Honda D Series Forum banner

1 - 20 of 20 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
141 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
any heard of somebody taking a 1.8 and sleeving it down to a 1.6, i know d series are the best engines. but say i took a b18 and sleeved it to a 1.6 and but a b16 head on there, would i be able to boost higher than if i bored out a 1.6 and sleeved it?
 
E

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
hmm I think I posted a Sleeving info here somewhere.. let me look for it.
 
E

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
Basic Information:

Block sleeving is the process of replacing part of the stock cylinder walls and pressing in a new Iron Ductile Sleeve into the block.
As you can see, the Iron Ductile sleeves are much thicker than the stock Cylinders.




Here are the Sleeves out of the block, before installation.
 
E

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
When to sleeve a block?

There are 2 reasons why racers chose to sleeve a block.
1. To increase displacement with a bigger bore.
2. To Strengthen the block for high boost applications.

Increasing the displacement on a Honda/Acura block is achieved through bigger bore size pistons or stroking the motor through different rods length and modifications on the crank. But in this case, we are focusing on Sleeving the block, so bigger bore sizes usually increase 1.8L B18 blocks all the way to 2.1L and slightly more. Since stock Acura/Honda blocks can only go .5 to 1mm overbore, we would need to SLEEVE the block to be able to do 3mm and even up to 6mm overbore on these B-series motors.

This is a common thing to do in All Motor setups. B18 motors usually go 84mm to become a 2.0L, while a B16 with 84mm bore will be about 1.8L Max bore on All Motor Race setups are 87mm bore while reliable bore for the street maxes out at 84mm. In effect, the bigger displacement usually end up in higher torque numbers in these setups.
For D-series, all motor streetable max bore size is 77/78mm bore and maxes out to 79mm for more aggressive setups.

Bigger bore blocks are also done in Turbo setups. But bore size is kept usually at 84mm max to still have a thick sleeve for strength on these high boost/high pressure applications. I personally don’t feel the need for big bore on Turbo setups. Many racers have been successful in making large amounts of HP with just an 81 or 81.5mm bore.
One racer that we sponsor is Courtney Green from Utah. His 93 Civic HB was pushing out mid 600HP on just a sleeved block bored to an 81.5mm



At this time its best ¼ mile time is 10.21 And it’s a true daily driven car using pump gas when driving around town.
Now the other reason to sleeve a block is to strengthen the block to be able to handle the high pressures during boost. The stock sleeves can actually handle a good amount of pressure, but in very extreme conditions, wouldn’t you want peace of mind knowing the block is prepped with a Thick Sleeve to hold these pressures. At boost, the block experiences more pressure than normal and can cause distortion and movement of the walls due to the heat and pressure. With these sleeves, it prevents that and keeps the block in tact to handle more stress than normal.

Common question we get:

Whats the max boost you can put on a stock sleeved block and compare to a Sleeved block?

On a B-series motor, we have pushed the limits to the high teens. 17-18psi on a stock block and I’m sure some have done even more. It will work ok at the very best tuning conditions. But we do recommend SLEEVING the block when you are reaching 14+ psi. This will ensure you have the block ready for those extreme stress the block will go through at that much boost. A sleeved block can handle over 40psi of boost. But 99% of turbo setups, would not go past the 25-30psi range anyways, so the sleeves are adequate enough for many turbo motors out there. And Max bore we usually go with is 84mm.
On D-series blocks, 10-12psi is usually the max we take it up to. More than 12 psi, we recommend sleeving the block already. For D-series blocks, the most we’d go on a turbo setup is a 77mm bore. We actually prefer keeping the 75 or 75.5mm bore on turbo D-series since piston choices are easier at that bore size. Anything bigger than 75.5mm bore is usually Custom pistons and causes more money. As in my previous comment on big bore turbo blocks, its not necessary to go way bigger bore on the D-series as well since the cost effectiveness of it isn’t going to be that significant. So 75 or 75.5mm bore is good enough.

Here’s a picture of a Sleeved 78mm D-series block.


I can go more and more on this subject later on. We can keep adding more information as you guys ask more questions about Sleeving.

Addendum 1: Block Guard

In the mid to late 90s, the block guard became popular since SLEEVING was not as common yet. The Block guard is suppose to prevent the movement of the Cylinder walls under high pressure. While it does hold it to a point, i certainly believe its not the best solution in high boost situations. Many believe that it can help in getting a few more lbs of boost over the limits of the stock block, but i think thats not necesarrily true.

If you ever see or have installed a block guard, they are a CNC Machined part that most often dont fit properly into the block. When you hammer them in between the cylinders and into the coolant passage, you can see that the only thing that actually holds them in is the pressure you exerted into block. Can that really hold that well? I dont believe so, there will still be some warping or movement of the cylinders since its not really a proper solution to the problem.

Another disadvantage is that it blocks the coolant passage at the top. At high boost pressure, you get a lot of heat in the engine and when you think about it, that top part of the block isnt actually cooled down as it should be. There are holes in the block guard, but its not as flowing as it would have without it.

My overall opinion is either you SLEEVE it or you dont. Don't make the block guard an easy fix to the problem.
 
C

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
Are sleeves complicated to install? Or do you just tap them in?
 
P

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
:shocked: :thehump: omg :shocked: i just crapped myself... that engine with those pistons are SICK! i want that block
 
E

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
civicrunner said:
Are sleeves complicated to install? Or do you just tap them in?
Sleeves are not done at home or any machine shop. Sleeves require CNC cutting of the existing block to PRECISE Measurements. Theres no trial and error here. A Machinist will have to know what to do to make these work.

Once the existing cylinder sleeves are cut, the Iron Ductile Sleeves are pressed in to the block. About 10 tons of pressure is done to press them in. And its not as simple as just pressing them in. The Sleeves have to be PRECISELY cut to fit the existing sleeves so they are tightly pressed into the block.

This is beyond a level 10 install. You have to be a specialist in machining and KNOW exact measurements for your CNC machine to cut the sleeves.
 

·
D-series wise guy
Joined
·
2,858 Posts
dank91 said:
any heard of somebody taking a 1.8 and sleeving it down to a 1.6, i know d series are the best engines. but say i took a b18 and sleeved it to a 1.6 and but a b16 head on there, would i be able to boost higher than if i bored out a 1.6 and sleeved it?
I think that you may a little confused/misled here. In general, you do not change an engine's displacement from 1.6 to 1.8L and vice versa by sleeving it. You do this by changing the bore or stroke. The b16 and b18 use the same size bore, only difference is the stroke.

And while the d-series is a nice little engine, it isn't hardly the best.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
936 Posts
? what's happening here. why destroke? just buy the b16 block if you're trying to destroke a b18. the b18 and b16 have the same bore but different stroke ratio (also the b18 is about 8mm longer than the b16) as kommon said. are you trying to lower compression? or are you trying to rev high?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
141 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
i want the b16 vtec head but i wanna boost like 30 psi so i figured if i sleeved the b18 with sleeves so big that i could just rebuild it basically all b16 and boost like a mutha actually this wasnt my idea but me and my friend were talking about it the other day we were thinking big ass sleeves and all titanium parts, revving around 13000 and boosting like crazy=fast enough
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
141 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
on another note about sleeves though: im aquiring a ZC DOHC non vtec engine for my 90 LX before i install i want to make the block bulletproof because i plan on boosting in the near near future <i hope anyway> what are some other good ideas to make sure im not going to have any problems with my block



by the way im still stuck on that misfire problem SOMEBODY HELP!!!!

http://www.d-series.org/forums/showthread.php?p=104429#post104429

oh yeah and also selling a 91 accord ex auto on the east coast if anyones interested
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,075 Posts
retarded as his dual exhaust and windsheild washer lights, but yea wil was right he posted all the info you needed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,075 Posts
Arachnid said:
don't hate on the d. hehe. i say if you have the money resleeve an h22 into 2.6 or somthing and boost the shit outa that bitch = faster than a 1.6 with high boost.
or even a better a k24 bored to 2.8l with a k20r head and lots of boost.
 

·
Brokedick Millionaire
Joined
·
40,237 Posts
kommon_sense said:
I think that you may a little confused/misled here. In general, you do not change an engine's displacement from 1.6 to 1.8L and vice versa by sleeving it. You do this by changing the bore or stroke. The b16 and b18 use the same size bore, only difference is the stroke.

And while the d-series is a nice little engine, it isn't hardly the best.
Sleeving the block, so bigger bore sizes usually increase 1.8L B18 blocks all the way to 2.1L

Wil, 78 mm D15 block, using 137-140 mm rods. Just gonna copy you know who......
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
141 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
im not knocking the D (even though nobody ive talked to can tell me whats wrong with my d15) this was just something me and my buddy were talking about and i had never heard of anyone doing that and was just wondering if anyone had ever heard of anyone doing that we like i said we were talking about all titanium internals and gigantic sleeves but thats, cool, apreciate all the info on sleeving
so back to that misfire problem?????????
 
1 - 20 of 20 Posts
Top