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Civic EG5
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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I have a ITR steering rack going into my EG5 to shorten the steering.
In the process of switching racks I'm planning to also delete the power steering.

Now from what I understand, the common method of PS delete is to loope the rack at the pressure inlet from the pump and to the return hose going to the reservoir. This is known to perform pretty good, and might as well be the best option for all I know.

I have been scratching my head looking at sketches of the rack and it's distribution valve. With this setup the oil moved by the piston inside the rack has to go by this valve in order to return to the other side of the piston. Seeing how intricate the valve is, I believe that there has to be some amount of resistance in it, all the while it's no longer active by means of high pressure oil.

Therefore I'm planning to also loop the fittings on the cylinder to allow the oil to flow freely the shortest way to the other side of the piston.

Time will tell if this can at all aid a lighter steering.
I might end up like a fool with nothing won, but atleast it is worth a shot.
All it costs me is a few fittings and some bits of hose.

Any opinions?
Flame away! :)

Posting a sketch for illustration.
I took some notes of the sizes of fittings also.
Can come in handy if someone would like to try it later on.
BTW, fittings are metric.

EDIT: Both cylinder and valve will off course be filled with oil and also vented to a separate reservoir.



 

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duh
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sounds good to me

I wish my rack had quicker steering, Its kinda scary when your skidding in snow and you have to turn the wheel back and forth like 10 times lock to lock to keep it on the road.
 

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BMX bike
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sounds good to me

I wish my rack had quicker steering, Its kinda scary when your skidding in snow and you have to turn the wheel back and forth like 10 times lock to lock to keep it on the road.
chains?


to OP:

I had three hoses coming from my rack I deleted the P/S cooler and pump and ran all three lines directly to the resivoir

 

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Civic EG5
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Discussion Starter #4
I had three hoses coming from my rack I deleted the P/S cooler and pump and ran all three lines directly to the resivoir
Yep, just as easy as looping and vents the air better.
But with this setup the oil still has to pass through the control valve.

The DC2 rack differs as it has only two connections to/from pump and reservoir. In addition it has the external pipes from the control valve to the cylinder, which makes my approach possible. On a civic rack I think the oil channels to the piston is internally, so you have no choice.
 

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Live,love,laugh,be real
96' Accord Wagon
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i have been runnin mine wide open for over 5 years now, no problems at all...
 

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Civic EG5
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Discussion Starter #6
i have been runnin mine wide open for over 5 years now, no problems at all...
Not saying these other options doesn't function satisfactory.
Only want to see if I can try to make it just a little bit better.
The effort is minimal, so if nothing is gained, nothing is lost either.

Running the rack open there must be little to no oil left in your cylinder.
Once going lock to lock and back, most of the oil is effectively pumped out of the rack.
Again, not saying it is bound to kill your rack over time, but I myself would atleast loop it back in to keep it lubricating and protecting the internals.
 

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Live,love,laugh,be real
96' Accord Wagon
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5 years and over a 150k miles, if it were going to fail, it would have a long time ago...
then again, i didn't know about the method your talking about, i prolly would have done it also, if i knew about it...
 

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I survived code 9
1998 Honda Civic DX
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1,662 Posts
Bro, I've got mine looped...probably for a year now. No issues. I love it! It's sooo fucking amazing.

The power increase is kinda nice, cause it's all the way across the power band. The feeling is what gets me...I love it...there's nothing like hitting the twisties afterschool with no PS. It's great.

The only time it sucks is when you have to do a 3 point turn around. Parking lots are no issue, and around the city I can drive with one hand. Keep in mind I have the light rims (hx's)



sry I don't have a better pic, but see the thing on the right hand side? It goes to a motorcycle brake res. What you do is get it hooked up and add a lot of fluid, and then turn the wheel so that it releases pressure (makes a mess) and when it gets nice and loose put the top on it.
 

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98 civic ex coupe
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good thread Im interested in this cause I'm going to be deleting my ps when I install my new turbo setup. Considering a few different ways now. I was gona just throw in a manual rack but cant find one cheap at local junkyards. interested to see what most people do. I have heard of some setups just leaving some fluid in the rack and plugging the lines.
 

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Civic EG5
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Discussion Starter #10
good thread Im interested in this cause I'm going to be deleting my ps when I install my new turbo setup. Considering a few different ways now. I was gona just throw in a manual rack but cant find one cheap at local junkyards. interested to see what most people do. I have heard of some setups just leaving some fluid in the rack and plugging the lines.
Note that the method I'm describing is for an ITR rack.
This has the external fittings directly on the cylinder.

As for plugging the lines, that is a definite no-no.
Oil, air or whatever moved by the piston needs to go somewhere.
Leave it open or loop it back to the other side.
 

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10 second daily driver :)
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Bro, I've got mine looped...probably for a year now. No issues. I love it! It's sooo fucking amazing.

The power increase is kinda nice, cause it's all the way across the power band. The feeling is what gets me...I love it...there's nothing like hitting the twisties afterschool with no PS. It's great.

The only time it sucks is when you have to do a 3 point turn around. Parking lots are no issue, and around the city I can drive with one hand. Keep in mind I have the light rims (hx's)



sry I don't have a better pic, but see the thing on the right hand side? It goes to a motorcycle brake res. What you do is get it hooked up and add a lot of fluid, and then turn the wheel so that it releases pressure (makes a mess) and when it gets nice and loose put the top on it.
i would rather have the PS then the .001 hp it frees up, modern power steering pumps dont drain near as much power away as the ones on our grandpas cars did. just keep it and enjoy the 1 finger 3 point turns. dont believe me? go to the drags, make a pass, remove the belt and make a pass, the difference in time will be so small you will put the belt righ tback on so its easier to drive.
 

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98 civic ex coupe
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I dont think my ps pump will fit with my ramhorn. I haven't had a chance to mock everything up but I doubt it will work without some modification. I wont be removing it for power thats for sure. I might be able to modify it but I hate to hack my new manifold for ps.
 

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Honda Civic
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good thread Im interested in this cause I'm going to be deleting my ps when I install my new turbo setup. Considering a few different ways now. I was gona just throw in a manual rack but cant find one cheap at local junkyards. interested to see what most people do. I have heard of some setups just leaving some fluid in the rack and plugging the lines.
x2 I was thinking of doing this because I've always desired the feel of the road over power steering.

Now are there any advantages of "looping" over Trons setup? I'm very interested to know more about removing my ps pump but like EKBoostedY8 said, the manual racks are expensive at the junk yard. Just trying to make good use of what I have, ya know.
 

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[/QUOTE]

I took those two fittings and just looped them with some hose with a little fluid in them.

I had it completely pluged before with some hollow bolts i got made but I heard you want the fluid to circulate to extend the life. :clover:
 

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BMX bike
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I chose to run the hoses to the resivoir beacuse it was easy to do and I think that I remember something about having the fluid vented to atmosphere vs a completly closed system being good.
 

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Live,love,laugh,be real
96' Accord Wagon
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lol
i got rid of mine cause i keep blowing out head light bulbs and its not easy with the reservoir and crap in the way, i will say that i do like the feel of it more with out the power... :td:
 

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I survived code 9
1998 Honda Civic DX
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1,662 Posts
i would rather have the PS then the .001 hp it frees up, modern power steering pumps dont drain near as much power away as the ones on our grandpas cars did. just keep it and enjoy the 1 finger 3 point turns. dont believe me? go to the drags, make a pass, remove the belt and make a pass, the difference in time will be so small you will put the belt righ tback on so its easier to drive.
Ummm... I like it. I don't drag race, I like twisties. It's amazing the feeling you get. You feel everything about the road.

By the way, when you just remove the belt it's going to be a BITCH. You're forcing fluid through a pump. My setup just goes through hoses and avoids the pump/reservoir.

If it's that hard without the pump and you drive a civic. Hit the gym.

Probably not something most people want to do for a daily driver, but it doesn't bother me one bit...
 

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Civic EG5
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Discussion Starter #20 (Edited)
Ok time to pick this one up again.
Received the last parts for me to finish this setup today.

Bought a Tilton reservoir for the steering rack oil ventilation along with other various parts, clamps, hoses, etc.


Also aquired a fitting adapter and a hose fitting for where the pressure pipe from the pump once connected.
This as the stock one was broken on the rack that I have.


Then I took the stock pipes on the rack off and cut it to pieces.
It is kind of hard to aquire these metric fitting with such fine threads, so I made my own out of the old OEM parts.



Started bench testing the rack setup, and primed it with oil.
Was actually a lot of air in there.
I set up a rig with transparent hoses to better see the bubbles going out.
Took many cycles slowly going lock to lock before all the air was gone, but man did it make a difference.
All the weird noises from the rack disappeared.



Also, I filled the valve body with oil.
When running the rack on the bench it became obvious that the valve did not circulated the oil while turning.
So then I see no reason to vent this part of the rack.
I topped it up with oil for conservation and sealed both ends of the valve like so:


When all the air was extracted I temporary sealed the cylinder while mounting the rack in the car.

 
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