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Discussion Starter #1
I had another thread I posted regarding a TD05 4AGTE build I had a considerable hand in that was based mostly off info I found on this site. We were also talking about the 4AGE 20V and how it is over played and under performs (Sarge lol). Then I found this:





Here is his build sheet.

4agte 20v
4agze bottom end - 0.5mm oversized pistons
Blacktop 20v head
Custom intake manifold with velocity stacks
Large Masterpowers turbo
800cc sard injectors

This is with stock rods and factory pistons. He made 512 whp at 32 psi but has it tuned for the street at 355whp at 20 psi.

My question is that I just bought (but have yet to receive) an 89 Hatch. I don't know chassis codes yet nor motor codes but I would like to do something special with it. I have Borg Warner T3T4 57 trim with clipped P trim turbine that has been freshly rebuilt. I have been thinking about building a track rag. Basically gut the interior (which would have to be done anyway as it is rotten) and spray bomb the bitch. It has a 4 speed in it which I don't know how tough it is or what not nor do I know if the axles will handle what I plan on trying to make. I would really like to crack the 500whp mark.

What else would I need to consider to make this a reality? Can a vitara setup with FJ distributors handle this type of abuse? Would running E85 suffice as well? Most miportantly do you think I can get that big of a turbo to make 5 psi by 4K?

Thanks and before it gets said I am not trying to start any shit about Honda vs Toyota. I just appreciate this forum more.
 

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Discussion Starter #2
Damn guys. No interest at all?

I figured I would at least get flamed.
 

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Not that impressive for that much boost on a "large" turbo, little ol' economy motor D16 can do that with a fairly mild cam on less boost.

You could easily do that on vitaras or similar forged pistons with the addition of a decent turbo cam and maybe an intake manifold. Its in the danger zone for breaking sleeves but if its a track car thats not a big deal.
You need a different transmission for sure though.
 

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I personally would never use Vitaras if I were shooting for over 400hp. Forged slugs aren't really that expensive, and in the long run will definitely benefit you in high hp setups.

However in a gutted ED hatch, you aren't going to need a ton of hp to run fast times. Should hit 11s with less than 400hp with a good trans and slicks, so Vitaras might be a good choice. d-series builds are for the most part cookie cutter, focus on the turbo kit and tune and you can't really go wrong.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Damn guys that is ppretty impressive to me especially for a 4AGE. The most I have seen on a budget build was 587 whpp on a stock GZE block with 272 cams and Ching Chong T70 that was made at 9400 RPMs and did not start spooling till 5k.

I would like to build a block ready for the abuse and I am sure the stocker is not ideal. What is a good motor to upgrade to for what I have in mind? I have access to a junk yard and get killer deals so it should not be to hard to find something useful. SHould I look for a motor and tranny setup together?

Thanks
 

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Motor/trans combo isn't always the cheapest route. Look for pretty much any 1.6, I would prefer the a6 or z6 for the better oiling, but the y series work fine.

As for trans, make sure you get an SI(large bearing case). Lots of people try to pawn off the small bearing cases as SIs because people simply do not know the difference.

FWIW:

Large bearing case - PL3/B000/3000/6000/9000
Small bearing case - PL3/A000/A1000/whatever else not listed above

Stamp is right above the fill plug


 

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Discussion Starter #8
Now you guys know if I swapped the 4AGE part of the equation out for a D16 you all would be going nuts right now. Its cool and I fell ya but it is not my intentions to flaunt the dyno at all. My point is that I like the setup, the cost, and its simplicity so I was wanting to see if I could get similar results with a D (or better). Honestly it reminded me of the D builds I see on here all the time.

You do have to admit that this level of hp on stock internals is damn impressive for 1.6 liter.


To be honest I am thinking about doing a back to back dyno session using a D16 in my Hatch and then running the exact same setup on my AE and see how they compare. Something simple like a T3 60 trim with a .48 hot and a .60 cold. Run stock unmodified blocks and heads. Run the exact same style manifold, bov, wastegate, boost controller, intercooler, exhaust diameter, etc. Then do one with my modifed setups. My damn 4AGE head should be able to flow some impressive #s after all the work I have had done to it and the cams I am using.

I really feel they would mirror each other with the D16 spooling faster and the 4AGE pulling a little harder at redline. I have seen several comparable builds and up to this point that is how they have played out.
 

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I certainly wouldn't be impressed. I haven't been impressed with many drag builds lately, and I think the only really interesting build I've seen in the past few months is the SpeedFactory build. THAT car has an impressively huge power curve for what it is.

*shrugs* I'm a weirdo, though. I'm sure that you'll have a great time learning and doing, and that's more important than figuring out what is more impressive to some dudes on the internet. :p
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Like I said I understand. A lot of builds do not impress me either so don't feel bad. It seems like most poeple are just copying others. Hard to find an origina build anymore.


Link to the Speedfactory build?
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I dunno about this now. My buddy has a 93 coupe with a B18C5 conversion (including tranny) he is letting go fo $4000. I am thinking that the B18 with my Borg Warner 57 trim would be fun.

This a good deal? The car is straight and interior clean. The outside of the car looks fatory except it is lowered and has 16" Rota Slipstreams.
 

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It could be, if you like other people's headaches. (Any car with a swap is not going to have 100% of the things done right, unless you buy something for what it cost, and that is usually 2-4x the price being asked.)

Without seeing pics and knowing how it runs and it's maintenance history, it could be a good deal.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
The swap is not hacked in at all. It has an intake, skunk 2 intake manifold, a DC sports header and custom built 2.25" exhaust. It also has an upgraded half radiator. It has Hasport mounts and centerforce clutch (which I was not really happy with). It has a Ksport coilover setup and some cheap strut bars. It has Blox LCa's and the bar that goes across the rear at the ground? The body is straight but the paint is crappy. The interior is clean but it is stock. The motor runs great once the temp gets up. The VTEC will not engage until the temp is about a 1/4 way up on the scale which takes about 10 minutes of driving. It has a Hondata ECU as well and a LC-1 wideband. The boy that is trying to sell it to me actually works at a Garage and I know him really well. I also trust him. He however did not do the swap but it was done professionally and he has the receipts. I would like to swap everything over to my Hatch but it is so busted I do not have the heart.

I am sure I can get it for $3500 maybe even $3000. It was scary to drive as it felt like it had torque steer but I am pretty sure it is just how the alignment was set up. I can get pictures.
 

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I certainly wouldn't be impressed. I haven't been impressed with many drag builds lately, and I think the only really interesting build I've seen in the past few months is the SpeedFactory build. THAT car has an impressively huge power curve for what it is.

*shrugs* I'm a weirdo, though. I'm sure that you'll have a great time learning and doing, and that's more important than figuring out what is more impressive to some dudes on the internet. :p
I hope my build interested you a bit. I'm running one of mhamrick's turbos
 

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Discussion Starter #19
How is my hybrid holding up? I was really expecting more from it so I was hoping you would tinker a bit more with it.
 

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How is my hybrid holding up? I was really expecting more from it so I was hoping you would tinker a bit more with it.
I will find out tomorrow. Back to the dyno for me. And this time, I'm taking my memory stick so I can get my damn session files. :yes:
 
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