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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Well, sammyd here, winter is coming up and the plans for the civic have begun, First I have a 95 civic EX coupe with a Z6 w/89K. I have minor mods such as nitrous, Apexi N1 catback, cam gear, intake, etc etc.. I have been thinking about a B (GSR), I know thats a bad word on here. My goals are as follows to have 500WHP and/or hit a 10sec 1/4 mile (with lots of practice). Right now my best time is a 14.989 (with nitrous) and my dynoed WHP with a 55 NX wet shot is Max Power 158.3 Max Torque 162.7 and without nitrous Max Power 117.8 Max Torque 99.6. I know some of u have read a few of my posts concerning my dyno slips and track runs. All of my mods are included in my post about the dyno slip with nitrous. I know my track times suck due to driver, experience, and crappy tires and suspension, my times should be faster. Well my dilemma is whether to pull the Z6 and build or just by a GSR and build. GSR's cannot be had for around then less than $3,000(hmotorsonline.com) and trying to find one at a junkyard is a challenge that will about a lifetime or one that is not stolen or has a hole on the block that I can put my hand through. I also made the post about the 345 HP Z6 95 SI hatch yesterday. That impressed me but still not convinced. Why do all pro draggers use B-series motors- more potential? Why no D's? There has got to be a reason. Money will not be an option, but would like the 3K in my pocket for my Z6, just think the amount of money I will spend to just SHIP the GSR will pay for a cam in my Z6. To all u experts will I be able to hit my goals as listed above with my lowmileage Z6?, I have put alot of money into my Z6, but if I cannot hit my goals I will be dissapointed and it will be a waste of my time and money. Please give me your thoughts and opinions. I plan on starting to buy parts soon. Thanks. Your responses will make my decision for me. Its up to all of u- the experts, I have not found a better honda forum than this on the internet.
I know your opinions will be biased since this is a D site, please be honest, I know many of u have had experience with the B, prob some former owners and switch to the D.
Sam
 
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Discussion Starter #2
i would not spend 3g's on a gsr when you are producing more whp than the c1 right now. i would take that cash and put it towards a good sleeved block, nice exaust mani, cam, uber, fuel upgrades, and ignition. that alone would crush any b on the street and most on the track given the exption of hardcore racers and others with too much money to spend with out the knowledge. the reason that the b is much more liked along with the drag racing is cause the d has been done, the b came out and so everyone ditched the d cause it was the new cool thing to do along with the extra cam. just think about it. what is there for a b that isn't offered for the d. nothing that i've came across yet. even if you blew a block, who cares. think about it this way. you can almost buy 3 sleeved d16's for the price of nearly any b engine. the odds of blowing 3 build blocks would easily outweigh the price of a factory b engine any day. the fact of being an underdog like bisi when racing and the look of someone's face alone would be well worth it. screw all the hype man. that's all it is. that's only the start of the list. im sure many will come in and prove more grounds on this and it's only the start. stay with the roots. D all the way. peace.
 

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allwheeldriveturboboxer
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B's and the like are in favor because of 2 main issues, cam tuning flexibility and displacement. Also, Honda invested alot of its R&D to make the B's a performer out of the box, vs. the D's which are made to make the best out of an economical, gas efficient power plant.

In my opinion, if you are going to look for max power NA in a full interior street car, go with a B (or H or K). B after B is making over 230-240 whp and shit loads of torque. http://www.gbrtuning.com/dynos.html

It is really what are you looking to do, prove a point, be a sleeper, be different, or go the fastest---

It is true that mod vs. mod, a B with 5k invested will be faster than the D with the same amount of mods, but it will be run of the mill and "another one of them"...This is what has kept me involved with D's, along with their cheap initial cost; they are different, the underdog if you will and as we all have come to realize, can be made moderately powerful considering their roots/ origin.

The bottom line is, if you insist on being different, you can go just as fast in a built + boost/spray D on the street as you can in a built boosted/spray B, but it will be very rather expensive, naturally.

Be different than the majority; build the z6, sleeve it to 79mm, and spray the shit out of it, juice hidden of course ;-)
 

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95 CX Hatch
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I'm gonna go AGAINST the grain here. Go with the B...cause your goals are very far fetched and unrealistic. A 10 second street car hahaha someones been watching too much FNF. You're right, to have a 10 second car money cannot be a matter or a concern. You need some serious body modifications, lexan windows, carbon fiber parts, gutted interiors, custom made dash, suspension, rollcage, etc etc the list goes on and on. When you happen to fall off that cloud come back and visit us :)

Lets use a little math here. Your car weighs in at 2490lbs without driver. Also add in the extra weight of a B series engine plus the weight of say...a turbo (roughly an extra 45lbs) AND a rollcage to run at the strip legaly. We will say an extra 400lbs bringing your total race weight at 2890.

ET = (weight/hp)0.2841 x 6.9446

I entered 600hp and only netted a guestimated ET of 10.85 just barely in the 10's. Good luck. Then theres the whole traction issue deal thingy :p
 
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Discussion Starter #5
sammydhoff said:
My goals are as follows to have 500WHP and/or hit a 10sec 1/4 mile (with lots of practice).
Hmmm...as much as I love the D, I'd just suggest getting a b18. A 500 whp D is pretty unrealistic, even with a very built turbo setup. Plus, even if you reach that goal with a D, it would NOT be streetable, period.

But seriously, do you really need that much power? Say goodbye to traction. A fully built turbo D is good for over 300 whp and thats enough to propel you into the 11's or even lower (with a very good suspension setup of course).
 

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if you got money like that throw in a fucking K, and get an ass of custom parts, as well as a custom turbo setup, all pro draggers will be using the K soon, i just saw a video 9 sec NA rsx the other day....fuck me!!!!
 
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Discussion Starter #8
yea 500whp is streetable, just not with a D. But if he want's a shitload of power and has a huge wallet, he could try a turbo k24 bottom end/k20a2 head setup
 

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and into the 8's he goes. egot your set-up shouldn't even bother with 10's anymore. be the money man and go k series. get the d and have a really fun and cheap engine to rev on.
 
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Discussion Starter #11
buy a b18b dohc non vtec and a turbo kit
i dont care what anybody trys to tell you but your goals are not happening with a d series. i have a friend with a turbo LS in a 88 hatch at 13lbs he runs 12.3s stock motor factory honda lsd spent 2600. same car with a fully built sleeved d16 at 18 lbs ran a high 12 once in the winter spent 4500.
if you want all motor b16 built head high compression pistons with crower all motor cams rev to 10,000 rpm and run about the same as the LS turbo.
but no matter what your not getting streetable 10s out of any fwd anything so lower your goals save some money and ditch the d.
 

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why the fuck would you want to be in the 10's there's no way that'll happen with a d. unless you have a shit load of money to spend on it and in anycase it wouldn't be streetable if n/a. and even so i still wouldn't trust driving "outa town" with a known 10 sec. no matter how it's built n/a or turbo.

get the damn b if you're lookin for 300+ reliable power. but the most of us here we are budget builders and so high 11's and low 12's once or twice at the track is fine with us.
 
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