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Adia's Daddy
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well, i did a search for "GREDDY" and after going thru page after page of what seemed to be topics about turbos and Greddy items, i figured i'd ask this question to get some real world feedback.

after stewing all weekend over my all-motor options my gf and i have come to the conclusion that perhaps we might be better off boosting a D16. we were presented with the idea of a complete **COUGH COUGH**B18C1 swap**COUGH COUGH for $4000CDN installed but seeing as how I can get a D16Z6 for cheap and my distributor deals Greddy we've been thinking of going over to the dark side of boost.

here's the questions:

1) New Greddy D16Z6 complete kit with intercooler OR APEXi complete kit with intercooler?
2) which turbo kit would work best for streetable and reliable power and performance on a seasonal daily driver?
2) do any of you have some real-world exp or feedback on either of those kits?

my distributor deals with Greddy and APEXi so I can get either one at a nice dealer cost. I know the greddy kit is cheaper priced and comes with the E-manage unit whereas the APEXi unit is more but comes with a ballbearing turbo. basically i'd like a nice quick street car that can handle the rigors of seasonal daily driving and family needs. i like the fact that the D-series engines are very inexpensive and relatively easy to come by at most yards.

thanks for the replies all and don't be too shy with the info.

Steve-O.

P.S. i've loooked into the Edelbrock kit but my dealers don't get it in so i'd have to pay full CDN dollar for it since it carries a very hefty USD price tag
 
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Ive heard good things about the Greddy kit but havent heard anything on the Apexi kit.
 
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Greddy takes the cake in my opinion. I took a 96 car with that kit to 250 wheel power. (and hondata with larger injectors)
 
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oscarmayer said:
Greddy takes the cake in my opinion. I took a 96 car with that kit to 250 wheel power. (and hondata with larger injectors)
The greddy kit doesn't take any cakes... it's just the least expensive pre fab kit (still overpriced). Your crazy to spend $1,000+ on hondata when you can get the same performance from uberdata for free. The best option doesn't exist because it requires you to build your own kit.

-the 4th grade internet warrior
 
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Beer you need to realize that despite the fact you "CAN" get the same performance, these people are NOT expirneced with cars and thus don;t have all the ability to perforum the tasks of self tuning, modifying their ecu and more. Not to mention some don;t want to chance. Please save the uberdata units for Expirenced techs and not novice users. Your going to get someone to listen to you one of these days and their going to blow their motor over your opinion. While you liek it and you haev completed 1 junker backyard turbo project (claps) you still have much to udnerstand and learn about the over all setups and udnerstand. it's not just sticking on any old turbo and instlalign some large injectors and tunnign andf going. even in engine building there is a LOT of detaihat if over looked will not only cost you performance but engine life in any performance applications.

Don't get me wrong I understand you have every intentino to assist the best you can, but please understand these kinds of questions liek this are novice users not guys who have expirnece. not even with 1 custom kit. This is the kind of question that is best kept simple and anmswered in a way they user can not only relate to and understand, but also the ability to learn from on their own ina "SAFE" enviroment. Sending someone off to tun their own car when they have no expirnece with even building a motor is like me handing you a stinger w/o ever instructing you how to use it and expectign you to shoot down anythign that comes you way. "IF" you even got it operating (7 steps just to open it and 2 to arm) aiming is a totally different story as well. So I hope i was able to put my explination into better perspective for you. Again i'm not baggin you but trying to help you see how best to help diffrent level of users.
 
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92civic said:
Ive heard good things about the Greddy kit but havent heard anything on the Apexi kit.
i liked my experience with the greddy kit. although i wouldnot pay retail or actucally i would never buy it brand new. just buy it used. for instance in my case if i sell it i only want like 1800. that includes the greddy basic 92-95 kit,type 31 fmic,type s bov,missing link,vortec fmu and steel braided oil feed and return lines. my kit has just about 1500miles and for the price u would pay new would be around 2800. i would rather have a drag kit for that price.

as far as the apexi kit,if u can find one i would buy it. they come with a ballbearing ihi turbo. pretty much same size as a greddy unit. to my best knowlodge they have been discontinued by apexi but im sure there is still a few out there.
 

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Adia's Daddy
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Discussion Starter #8
oscarmayer said:
Beer you need to realize that despite the fact you "CAN" get the same performance, these people are NOT expirneced with cars and thus don;t have all the ability to perforum the tasks of self tuning, modifying their ecu and more. Not to mention some don;t want to chance. Please save the uberdata units for Expirenced techs and not novice users. Your going to get someone to listen to you one of these days and their going to blow their motor over your opinion. While you liek it and you haev completed 1 junker backyard turbo project (claps) you still have much to udnerstand and learn about the over all setups and udnerstand. it's not just sticking on any old turbo and instlalign some large injectors and tunnign andf going. even in engine building there is a LOT of detaihat if over looked will not only cost you performance but engine life in any performance applications.

Don't get me wrong I understand you have every intentino to assist the best you can, but please understand these kinds of questions liek this are novice users not guys who have expirnece. not even with 1 custom kit. This is the kind of question that is best kept simple and anmswered in a way they user can not only relate to and understand, but also the ability to learn from on their own ina "SAFE" enviroment. Sending someone off to tun their own car when they have no expirnece with even building a motor is like me handing you a stinger w/o ever instructing you how to use it and expectign you to shoot down anythign that comes you way. "IF" you even got it operating (7 steps just to open it and 2 to arm) aiming is a totally different story as well. So I hope i was able to put my explination into better perspective for you. Again i'm not baggin you but trying to help you see how best to help diffrent level of users.
well, i just started my own performance parts ordering business in October to help out the enthusiasts and bring the scene to our area as well as have a source to build my own Honda. even tho i've been doing things to my Civic since the late 90's, i started out rice and went through a lot of changes and different styles before i settled into the performance/racing scene. i'm slowly but steadily learning the intricacies of Honda/Acura/sport compact tuning and building so i would definitely consider myself a novice (a.k.a. newbie) who still has LOTS to learn. but I love to learn and thats the reason why i find myself on this computer for hours each day chatting, posting and reading up on things. because of the area where I live and the fact that my friends and I are the few who would d these kinds of things to our Hondas, we pretty much livbe under a rock here unless we make the 3+ hour exodus to Toronto where the scene is pretty much centered.

the reason the Greddy kit appealed to me if we decide to go boost is because: 1) i can get it and any other Greddy component I need at dealer cost.......2) I like the fact it's a completel kit. so long as I have all the proper tools available and I can work in a comfortable, clean environment, i am confident in my mechanical Honda-wrenching abilities enough to tackle the install on my own (with the help of some extra hands, hefty arms and online tech brains when needed :D )............3) greddy/trust is a reputable company from what i've read and they've been around im sure long before i started picking up Super Street magazine about 6 years ago.

I'll probably end up going with the Greddy kit but i'd like to do alot more research on it and hear more feedback from people about it. upgradeability is something I know it has and I like that when it comes to perf parts should i decide my car is too slow after installing it :roll: .

the Edelbrock kit is nice and i've looked into it alot but i'd have to pay retail for so it's been bumped from the equation. if I had to pay full retail for a kit the Edelbrock would probably be the one but thats only based on what i've seen from their website and what it comes with. i haven't really read alot on how it works and how it holds up.
 
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The revhard kit is the best kit for under $3k. It includes most of the upgrades you will make with the greddy. Just make sure it comes w/ a tial WG instead of the delta. In all honesty i would sell the BOV and all the fuel management crap it comes w/. get a cheaper BOV for $50 or so and get some real fuel management and call it a day.

Should cost you about $3k. Again you could build a custom kit for half that price, but its really your call. Kit wise, I like the revhard and actually the full race kit is damn sexy too. ill pricey but twice as sexy as the revhard
 
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Your calling my turbo kit a junker backyard kit? My turbo kit will own any kit out there because I actually have real fuel management. All the pre-fab kits out there come with garbage for fuel management. I think I did pretty well considering I made 216whp at 10 psi on a stock Z6 and only spent $1,100 on my turbo kit (most of the parts being brand new). I'm not suggesting they tune their own car, hell I couldn't even do that. Anybody that can solder, would be able to socket your ECU and anybody that can use a computer, would be able to burn and install a chip in their car. Tuning I leave for the tuners.

It doesn't matter if your a beginner, I'm not forcing anybody to build their own turbo kit and chip their own ECU. I am just helping these people learn that you can do it yourself and save a lot of money. Maybe it's not for them and they really want a hondata/greddy setup, that's perfectly fine at least they learned a little bit. The only thing you do is tell them to buy hondata/greddy and pay somebody else to do everything for you. That's not helping anybody. I wouldn't have even posted on this thread if you didn't piss me off in another thread. Looks like this guy can get some pretty good deals on gredy stuff, so if he wants to do that great.
 

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look, i'm sorry but i have to say something. i don't have a beaf with either one of you two (beer or oscarmeyer) but ya'll need to take this debate to the pm messaging please. john is only trying to get some advice about which kit to use for his well being. weather or not he's a beginner or not is not relavent.

beer - you have good advice keep it coming, but don't try and tell someone that a custom turbo is going to out beat a kit even though it might. the custom turbo is probably better than the kits sure, but don't say that someone else is wrong about a particular kit unless you can back it up with some proof or something, please.

and oscar - please don't take these things personnaly. it's not a personal attack on you or anyone, even though it may be interprided as such. and i thank you for your post, aside from the argumentive ones and that goes for beer and everyone else out there arguing over who knows more, but please don't take anything seriously unless they are talking to you directly.

the people that know more about what they are talking about are going to be the ones who are listened to. so it would be best if everyone could only post if they do know what they are talking about(this is NOT an attack on oscar or beer. i'm sure the two of you have some knowledge in this area, and know what ya'll sayin.)

I apologize for hi-jacking the thread, please continue the advice and experiences with different turbo kits, and what each kit does and doesn't have. thank you, just had to blow off some steam.
 
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WOW this thread was so highjacked. Man sorry Hope you got your awnser out of soem of this.
 
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I just got my Apexi kit on a couple weeks ago. I drive an '89 hatch dx (see sig). Anyway, I bought the setup used:
Apexi manifold/IHI turbo/dp
JohnnyRaceCar fmic
Apexi bov
Apexi SAFC
Autometer boost gauge
Hallman mbc
DSM 450s
charges pipes, etc.
I bought everything above together for $1800. There were some fitment issues with the dp (cause of the front crossmember on the EF) and we had to massage :wink: the intercooler in. I'm only at 5-6 psi right now on the stock injectors. The pressure sensor isn't hooked up on the SAFC yet, so we held off on the 450s and 10 psi. This is my first experience with a turbocharged Honda, but everything has gone relatively smooth. I am real happy with the setup. It scoots even at 5 psi - the turbo spools so fast and comes on so hard that sometimes the wheels break loose upon spoolup (that is, just launching normal and then flooring it). The turbo starts spooling around 2000 rpms. If you can find the Apexi kit, I say go for it. I think all the setups out there have their advantages and disadvantages, but in the end, you still kick ass for having a boosted sohc.
 
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custom_junky said:
look, i'm sorry but i have to say something. i don't have a beaf with either one of you two (beer or oscarmeyer) but ya'll need to take this debate to the pm messaging please. john is only trying to get some advice about which kit to use for his well being. weather or not he's a beginner or not is not relavent.

beer - you have good advice keep it coming, but don't try and tell someone that a custom turbo is going to out beat a kit even though it might. the custom turbo is probably better than the kits sure, but don't say that someone else is wrong about a particular kit unless you can back it up with some proof or something, please.

and oscar - please don't take these things personnaly. it's not a personal attack on you or anyone, even though it may be interprided as such. and i thank you for your post, aside from the argumentive ones and that goes for beer and everyone else out there arguing over who knows more, but please don't take anything seriously unless they are talking to you directly.

the people that know more about what they are talking about are going to be the ones who are listened to. so it would be best if everyone could only post if they do know what they are talking about(this is NOT an attack on oscar or beer. i'm sure the two of you have some knowledge in this area, and know what ya'll sayin.)

I apologize for hi-jacking the thread, please continue the advice and experiences with different turbo kits, and what each kit does and doesn't have. thank you, just had to blow off some steam.
It's been taken to PM. I hope beer astops starting problem because he doesn't like people. I hope he realizes that if he;s going to offer advice he needs to do so with the understanding a lot of guys are novice totally and new to any of this and not think everyone can do a custom setup and uber data that is totally self relyant.

Anyways, It's been taken to pm and your right Sorry for the Hi-Jack guy.
 
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Steve-O said:
oscarmayer said:
Beer you need to realize that despite the fact you "CAN" get the same performance, these people are NOT expirneced with cars and thus don;t have all the ability to perforum the tasks of self tuning, modifying their ecu and more. Not to mention some don;t want to chance. Please save the uberdata units for Expirenced techs and not novice users. Your going to get someone to listen to you one of these days and their going to blow their motor over your opinion. While you liek it and you haev completed 1 junker backyard turbo project (claps) you still have much to udnerstand and learn about the over all setups and udnerstand. it's not just sticking on any old turbo and instlalign some large injectors and tunnign andf going. even in engine building there is a LOT of detaihat if over looked will not only cost you performance but engine life in any performance applications.

Don't get me wrong I understand you have every intentino to assist the best you can, but please understand these kinds of questions liek this are novice users not guys who have expirnece. not even with 1 custom kit. This is the kind of question that is best kept simple and anmswered in a way they user can not only relate to and understand, but also the ability to learn from on their own ina "SAFE" enviroment. Sending someone off to tun their own car when they have no expirnece with even building a motor is like me handing you a stinger w/o ever instructing you how to use it and expectign you to shoot down anythign that comes you way. "IF" you even got it operating (7 steps just to open it and 2 to arm) aiming is a totally different story as well. So I hope i was able to put my explination into better perspective for you. Again i'm not baggin you but trying to help you see how best to help diffrent level of users.
well, i just started my own performance parts ordering business in October to help out the enthusiasts and bring the scene to our area as well as have a source to build my own Honda. even tho i've been doing things to my Civic since the late 90's, i started out rice and went through a lot of changes and different styles before i settled into the performance/racing scene. i'm slowly but steadily learning the intricacies of Honda/Acura/sport compact tuning and building so i would definitely consider myself a novice (a.k.a. newbie) who still has LOTS to learn. but I love to learn and thats the reason why i find myself on this computer for hours each day chatting, posting and reading up on things. because of the area where I live and the fact that my friends and I are the few who would d these kinds of things to our Hondas, we pretty much livbe under a rock here unless we make the 3+ hour exodus to Toronto where the scene is pretty much centered.

the reason the Greddy kit appealed to me if we decide to go boost is because: 1) i can get it and any other Greddy component I need at dealer cost.......2) I like the fact it's a completel kit. so long as I have all the proper tools available and I can work in a comfortable, clean environment, i am confident in my mechanical Honda-wrenching abilities enough to tackle the install on my own (with the help of some extra hands, hefty arms and online tech brains when needed :D )............3) greddy/trust is a reputable company from what i've read and they've been around im sure long before i started picking up Super Street magazine about 6 years ago.

I'll probably end up going with the Greddy kit but i'd like to do alot more research on it and hear more feedback from people about it. upgradeability is something I know it has and I like that when it comes to perf parts should i decide my car is too slow after installing it :roll: .

the Edelbrock kit is nice and i've looked into it alot but i'd have to pay retail for so it's been bumped from the equation. if I had to pay full retail for a kit the Edelbrock would probably be the one but thats only based on what i've seen from their website and what it comes with. i haven't really read alot on how it works and how it holds up.
one thing you could look into is getting the later 96 greddy kit. why? it comes with a e-manage and 310 injectors unlike the 92-95 kits. That makes it totally awesome. you cna use it on any 92-2k civic for that mater. also the turbo on the newer kit is a -19 not a -15. it supports up to 300 wheel power instead of 250-260. So there is still good room for growth.

hope this helps.
 

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Adia's Daddy
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Discussion Starter #16
oscarmayer said:
...Anyways, It's been taken to pm and your right Sorry for the Hi-Jack guy.
hey man, no worries. your conversations have shown me that there's a lot more to turbos than I thought i knew :wink:
 

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Adia's Daddy
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Discussion Starter #17
h45454 said:
I just got my Apexi kit on a couple weeks ago. I drive an '89 hatch dx (see sig). Anyway, I bought the setup used:
Apexi manifold/IHI turbo/dp
JohnnyRaceCar fmic
Apexi bov
Apexi SAFC
Autometer boost gauge
Hallman mbc
DSM 450s
charges pipes, etc.
I bought everything above together for $1800. There were some fitment issues with the dp (cause of the front crossmember on the EF) and we had to massage :wink: the intercooler in. I'm only at 5-6 psi right now on the stock injectors. The pressure sensor isn't hooked up on the SAFC yet, so we held off on the 450s and 10 psi. This is my first experience with a turbocharged Honda, but everything has gone relatively smooth. I am real happy with the setup. It scoots even at 5 psi - the turbo spools so fast and comes on so hard that sometimes the wheels break loose upon spoolup (that is, just launching normal and then flooring it). The turbo starts spooling around 2000 rpms. If you can find the Apexi kit, I say go for it. I think all the setups out there have their advantages and disadvantages, but in the end, you still kick ass for having a boosted sohc.
it sounds nice (and the price tag with it new is more than the Greddy). but someone said it's no longer available so used would be the only option for that one.

im SO new to boost it's not even funny :p. i had considered the ideas of going just N/A with a SOHC but too much $$$ to make it scoot. then I thought about a swap to GSR but for around the same price I can get a boosted SOHC with potential to go more later on. the bonus to a SOHC which has kept me with them this long is if something happens to the motor itself, a D16Z6 is ALOT easier to come by and a boatload cheaper than a GSR

when i get the D16 and eventually boost it, to build my own kit if APEXi ones are no longer available would scare me at first so that's probably the only other "con" i have with the APEXi kit other than the price is like 1/3 more than the Greddy.

oscarmayer said:
...one thing you could look into is getting the later 96 greddy kit. why? it comes with a e-manage and 310 injectors unlike the 92-95 kits. That makes it totally awesome. you cna use it on any 92-2k civic for that mater. also the turbo on the newer kit is a -19 not a -15. it supports up to 300 wheel power instead of 250-260. So there is still good room for growth. hope this helps.
so the new Greddy 92-95 kit DOESN'T come with the E-Manage unit? i thought it did. also, wouldn't there be some wiring issues since you're putting an OBDII kit on an OBDI engine?

**EDIT** i just checked, it does come with it according to the Greddy site: http://www.greddy.com/products/product_detail.asp?catidx=3&catname=Turbochargers&prodtype=16&prodtypename=Turbo Kits (Bolt-on)&productidx=1302
 
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Okay, i think im going to have to burst your bubble here.

Emanage is a piece of shit. Its basically tricking your MAP sensor not to see boost. it advances your timing and all that bad shit. Its okay for boosting 5-8psi which is the limit to those 310cc injectors. Basically Greddy is making a kit exactly for 5-8psi. Look at the compressor map the damn turbo is in its efficiency range at 5-8psi outside of that it starts blowing hot air. I dont like the greddy kit unless you plan on using it for what greddy made it for.
 
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no actually that's a BIg msiconception. the emanage sits directly between the ijectros and the map of the engine. it controls not only modifies a/f liek an afc, BUT unknown to most of you here, it also controlls full injector pulse. YES you can adjust the duty cycle and impedance of the injectors making it capable of support 450 injectors ona stock motor properly. (FYi i called greddy directly to ask about the emanage and it's advantages OVEr he afc or simular proucts to it).
it does require the injector attachment to do so, but it will work fine. The newer turbo with the newer kit flows efficently at 16-17 lbs of boost and can support up to 300 wheel pwoer. How is that 6-8 psi only? where do you get your ifo from? i'ld like to know because your getting a LOT of inaccurate information. If you don't believe me on any of this, pick up the phone andcall greddy themselves. They are very nice and will answeer your questions w/o issues.


NO the 92-95 kit still used the blue/black box. it's their way of keeping costs of that older and soon to be faised out kit down. for the extra $350 i'ld go with the new kit. the cost of the emanage, injector harnes and the 310cc injecotrs make it great and capale of supprot up to 250-260 wheel power before needig larger inejctrors. you woudl have to obvesouly need to get a 3bar map to go above 11psi in boost, but that's standard with any thing.

also get an ebay $250 fmic. it will work fine and handle your needs for up to usually 350 wheel power.
 
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Dude, talk out of your ass some more please?????

First, please proof read your damn posts. They are near impossible to sort through. Actually dont proof read your posts because people shouldnt read your post because they are misinformed.

1) 310cc injectors will max out around 8psi. If you knew better Uberdata has a rough Duty Cycle Calculator in it and at 8psi on a Z6 with 310cc injectors you are at about 97% duty cycle. So you are wrong once again.

2) Greddy Emange still tricks your Map sensor so you can only boost up to the map sensor's limit which is about 10psi. So you are wrong again

3) The Greddy 15g turbo is in its peak efficiency range from .4-.6bar. Look at the compressor map, do some math(or search this very forum where i did the math for you) and you will see that its the truth.

4) calling a big company like greddy and asking them if their product sucks will work well..........last time i checked its their job to talk people into buying their product so i wouldnt trust their opinions. Their kit is very well engineered for exactly what is described on the box. 6-8psi and such. outside of that everything starts getting out of its efficiency range. you dont have to believe me, thats fine...but everytime you make a post im going to correct everything you say until you start saying the correct things. Its your choice whether you chose to actually learn or chose to be stubborn and post your lies. Sooner or later people will question what you say and find out that you are in fact full of shit
 
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