[Printz]

I want to run an air to water intercooler on my setup. I like it because it's more discrete than a front mount, it keeps it in the engine bay, shorter piping, I don't have to run the piping through the fenders, and it's just not done often. I want to find an intercooler like this one (intercooler) but that doesn't have 3 inch inlet and outlets. I also need a heat exchanger and a pump. I can find tubing at the local hardare store. This project might sound crazy but I am so that's normal. This is going in a 95 civic ex with a rhb5 vj11 turbo. I'm not in a hurry to buy this stuff, I just want to locate somewhere where I can buy it later on when I have the money.

 

[ryan89crx]

you realize that air to water ICs are only good for track use, right?

you have to have a constant supply of ice cold water in a tank somewhere which needs to be pumped through the IC at all times...

from what ive read, a standard 1-2gal tank of ice water only stays cold for about 2-3 runs at the track...

 

[Printz]

Thats why I'm going to run a heat exchanger in front of the radiator. They also have less pressure drop through them. But yes I will have to have a tank, but i'll get 2 tanks and put them in the trunk, one for the intercooler and one for water/alchohol injection.

 

[Printz]

anyone else have input?

 

[Jcazz]

Hummm another alternative would be to hook up a Chiller in the inside of your car....Use a converter to convert it to the power u need it to run....which in the house they are 120V so a reg converter with the right Amps will do the trick..is a pricey way to achieve your goal....but...would be different....they chillers usually go down to 40 F....i have also seen modded ones for "computer water cooling" that drop all the way down to 10F using the right amount of Glycol....another thing to point out as well, would be how long would it keep the temps low....or if they temps were say at, 10F then after X amount of runs/ Hours of use....how high would the temps raise ect.....the first thing to do is to find out how many BTU's you would need to remove....then justify Chiller size.....just an option if you wanted to look into it.....here is an expample of some chillers...here....

Remeber.....the less amount of storage water u need.....the faster the "pull down" Temps.....heres a link to one....http://cgi.ebay.com/1-3-HP-Via-Aqua...ryZ20758QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Remeber.....with the right working Brain! and the correct amount of money.....ANYTHING....will work.......Good luck..

 

[Printz]

All I want is a simple tubular air to water intercooler, heat exchanger, pump and resevior. I don't need a cooler or ice. I don't race, just daily driver, I just don't want the front mount like every one else.

 

[Chiovnidca]

Water/alcohol injection might be a good option.

 

[Printz]

Water/alcohol injection might be a good option.

I was going to run that too.

 

[cbuscivictuner]

well other then that pwr style they also sell the cheaper air to waters now if you want to buy one and see how it works out.For a heat exchanger look on ebay for mustang or supercharged truck one.I was also thinking of getting an auto radiator and runing it through the stock tranny cooler part.

I thought long and hard about doing a setup like this,yes it would be cool,yes it would be more efficient,but in the long run an fmic would be cheaper and more streetable.A dsm sidemounts stealth if thats all you want.

150 minimum for the air to water
50-75 for the mustang heat exhchanger
20 in piping,
75-120 pump
10 in wiring switches etc
75-120 dollar fuel cell
50-75 in lines

Im not gonna even add all that up.Im sure it can be done cheaper if you carefully find parts and what not or have hookups

heres the ebay one I was talking about
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BRAN...2QQihZ020QQcategoryZ33742QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

[99EJ6T]

All I want is a simple tubular air to water intercooler, heat exchanger, pump and resevior.

are you talking about the one vortech makes? ( http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/products/coolers/ ) not to be a dick, but you do realize a turbo sees a much much higher intake temp vs supercharger right?

yes it would be more efficient,

were did you read this? (edit: i found it myself)

 

[cbuscivictuner]

Its a know FACT that a air to water setup with ice for the first run can be over 100% efficient.After the ice melts without a heat exchanger that number dips down.Good fmic setups see usually around 80-maybe 90 percent on a good day.

 

[99EJ6T]

Its a know FACT that a air to water setup with ice for the first run can be over 100% efficient.

if you notice he was not talking about using ice. just water/coolant mix with a heat exchanger.

 

[cbuscivictuner]

Lol why would you not put Ice in it thats one of the best points of having an air to water system?Even without ice in it until it warms up its still more efficient.So yes an air to water setup is more efficient,is it the best thing for a street car?Thats in the air.There are daily driven air to water cars.


You do know alot of high horsepower race cars run air to water because its more efficient right?What does the supercharger having lower temps have to do with anything?

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1667755

On another note james made almost 600hp on an s2k using an xs power air to water intercooler so maybe they aren't crap,or he re welded it.

 

[99EJ6T]

Lol why would you not put Ice in it thats one of the best points of having an air to water system?

as the OP

You do know alot of high horsepower race cars run air to water because its more efficient right?

ok, you made yourself look dumb. race cars have pits to add ice to thier system. i don't see a pit team following me light to light.

What does the supercharger having lower temps have to do with anything?

heat generated during compression. simply put, superchargers produce less heat to be absorbed by the air charge. so it requires less area of dissapation (i.e. smaller intercoolers) to get the air temp into a low enough range to make good repeatable power.

 

[cbuscivictuner]

lol your making yourself look dumb.So what you are saying because its efficiency goes down its not more efficient?lol Ever heard of heat soak? an air to air setups efficiency level goes down as well on hot days.

There are plenty of daily driven air to water cars.Just because you don't know of any doesnt mean anything.

So fact, for the first run an air to water setup is more efficient then a air to air on the first run.True or false? your beating around the bush to make yourself look right.


The ice melting all has to do on the size of your tank.A 1 gallon cell is going to have the ice mount quick.On a street car a bigger cell will make the ice last longer ,so your light to light theroy is out the window.

 

[99EJ6T]

There are plenty of daily driven air to water cars.Just because you don't know of any doesnt mean anything.

who said i didn't know of any? about 30 mins from my house is a 2G gsr teg w/ vortech supercharger, car makes great power on the dyno with ice ready at hand, but on the street his car acts like a different car (IIRC he makes ~280 whp).

So fact, for the first run an air to water setup is more efficient then a air to air on the first run.True or false

true, on the first run. what about the second/third/fourth run, and we are talking about street cars not race cars, so that we don't beat around the bush.

Ever heard of heat soak?

no is that the thing i was trying to fight when i installed a intercooler?

The ice melting all has to do on the size of your tank.A 1 gallon cell is going to have the ice mount quick.On a street car a bigger cell will make the ice last longer ,so your light to light theroy is out the window.

how so? i mean you will have to fill the ice up sometime right? so when the ice is gone and you are just as efficient as the air to air guy, just a lot heavier, you got the advantage?

 

[cbuscivictuner]

heres a quote on ht from a air to water vs air air thread after someone said air to water intercoolers heat soak and lose power.

"The energy taken out of the charged air is transferred to water... that energy is then transferred back to the air... it is a cycle. If the amount of heat energy entering the system from the compressed air is more than the rest of the system can dissipate than you have a system where more energy is entering the system than is being taken out, you call the heat soak.

To correct or prevent this, you design a system that can remove the same amount of energy that is being put in. You can do this by increasing the volume of thermal mass absorbtion (water, water wetter, coolant etc.) or by increasing the amount of energy removed, i.e. the radiator or heat exchanger or fan. Or a combination.

I have a TEC-II on my car and can monitor (MAT) Manifold Air Temperatures. On a 90* day I consistently see MAT temps within a degree or two of ambient, whether on boost or idling in traffic. Same thing when it is 32* outside.

Of course there are limits to everthing. My current setup would heat up over time if I were road racing (constantly on boost). If that were the case I would increase the size fo the heat exchanger, as you would have to increase the size of an air to air intercooler. But for a road car that sees a little of everything (off boost and on boost) the systems works just fine"





So basically your friend,If he add a better heat exchanger,and bigger tank would have a better system on the street.The vortech unit's heat exchanger is the size of an oil cooler.Ever seen a mustangs or lighntings?They take up most of the grill,but most of the time you don't notice them.


Good way to avoid answering the question though but at least some decent tech came out of this for the OP

 

[Printz]

Freaking awsome info tuner! Also running an air to water, because the piping will be so short the throttle response would be incredible.

 

[jimmyb34]

my $.02 usually sucks but i might as well throw it out there.. if the only reason your wanting to get one is to be different... i think thats more of a waste of money imo
i might be wrong.. but isnt that turbo pretty small???? a front mount would be perfectly fine, cheaper, and easier...
i would imagine youd almost have to change your tune to compensate for different temps from the air to water also wouldnt you?

 

[Printz]

my $.02 usually sucks but i might as well throw it out there.. if the only reason your wanting to get one is to be different... i think thats more of a waste of money imo
i might be wrong.. but isnt that turbo pretty small???? a front mount would be perfectly fine, cheaper, and easier...
i would imagine youd almost have to change your tune to compensate for different temps from the air to water also wouldnt you?

I'm plan on using the system for any turbo setup I put in, I will eventually run a bigger turbo to put 250hp. Until then I will run my baby turbo. Getting it tuned will be the same as with a normal intercooler.