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I own a 93 civc hatch with a d15b7. I am going to replace the airbox and sound deadening plumbing with a k&n filter. I am sure that will be fine with the factory wot settings cause they are usually set pretty rich. I am not sure how well it will do with an a6 head and upgraded header and exhaust plus z6 intake manifold. I know it will eventuall need a tune just wondering if that will be pushing it without a tune. Thanks guys
 

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BATSLOMAN GIVES NO FUCKS.
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I own a 93 civc hatch with a d15b7. I am going to replace the airbox and sound deadening plumbing with a k&n filter. I am sure that will be fine with the factory wot settings cause they are usually set pretty rich. I am not sure how well it will do with an a6 head and upgraded header and exhaust plus z6 intake manifold. I know it will eventuall need a tune just wondering if that will be pushing it without a tune. Thanks guys
as long as your timing is spot on, it should run fine, no tune needed. Im actually running the same mods you have with no issues
 

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my name says Guest, but Im really a MEMBER
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I own a 93 civc hatch with a d15b7. I am going to replace the airbox and sound deadening plumbing with a k&n filter. I am sure that will be fine with the factory wot settings cause they are usually set pretty rich. I am not sure how well it will do with an a6 head and upgraded header and exhaust plus z6 intake manifold. I know it will eventuall need a tune just wondering if that will be pushing it without a tune. Thanks guys
get a wbo2 and record the afr before and after and you'll know. That's one thing I haven't seen on the net is someone that has tested the stock afr at say startup/cranking, cold, hot, WOT, etc. As to emulate. but also you could see if any tuning is really need at WOT like your asking with say basic bolt ons like an intake, etc.

to add, removing the sound deading is going to do shit and is a waste of time. the k&n is great because you can clean it and reuse it instead of spending money on paper filters. but if your going to do anything you might as well get a real cold air intake where the filter is outside the engine compartment. even that I wouldn't waste my time as it's not going to make your car any noticeably faster.

PS I didn't read your whole post. your talking about a few mods. in theory your WOT OL afr will be leaner then honda wanted it to be. by how my is the mystery. I ran a y8 on pm6 ecu and it pulled good so....... but like I said, I'd love to see a wbo2 on stock motors.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
get a wbo2 and record the afr before and after and you'll know. That's one thing I haven't seen on the net is someone that has tested the stock afr at say startup/cranking, cold, hot, WOT, etc. As to emulate. but also you could see if any tuning is really need at WOT like your asking with say basic bolt ons like an intake, etc.

to add, removing the sound deading is going to do shit and is a waste of time. the k&n is great because you can clean it and reuse it instead of spending money on paper filters. but if your going to do anything you might as well get a real cold air intake where the filter is outside the engine compartment. even that I wouldn't waste my time as it's not going to make your car any noticeably faster.

PS I didn't read your whole post. your talking about a few mods. in theory your WOT OL afr will be leaner then honda wanted it to be. by how my is the mystery. I ran a y8 on pm6 ecu and it pulled good so....... but like I said, I'd love to see a wbo2 on stock motors.
That would be interesting to see the wideband readings for sure. Unfortunately i will probably not be able to give you stock readings but i can probably give some readings with my bolt ons before i get tuned up come racing season next year.

I find it hard to believe that ditching the stock air box plumbing would do nothing, but hey if it does nothing at least it will sound kick ass lol
 

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my name says Guest, but Im really a MEMBER
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it's not going to sound kick ass. I did it and it does nothing!

I'm in kinda a good mood so I'll give you some advice as I've been where you are. throw in just a delta 272 cam with stock i/h/e and your car will be faster then with all these mods your thinking about putting in.
 

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()*#$(*$
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Most stock ECUs with BONE STOCK engines run at the very most 12.5-12:1 at WOT from about 2500RPM to redline, usually getting worse as you approach redline. (An H22 powered 'lude I know of was hitting near 11:1 at redline.)

OBD2 ECUs are horrific. Some hit 10:1.

Unless you significantly bump compression up, a stock ECU will be more than fine for most bolt ons. However, you WILL get much more from a chipped ECU that is tuned properly.
 

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my name says Guest, but Im really a MEMBER
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Most stock ECUs with BONE STOCK engines run at the very most 12.5-12:1 at WOT from about 2500RPM to redline, usually getting worse as you approach redline. (An H22 powered 'lude I know of was hitting near 11:1 at redline.)

OBD2 ECUs are horrific. Some hit 10:1.

Unless you significantly bump compression up, a stock ECU will be more than fine for most bolt ons. However, you WILL get much more from a chipped ECU that is tuned properly.
this is based of fact you've ether seen personally or from a trusted source????
 

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()*#$(*$
93 Legend L Coupe.
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Yup. Rushi is the source for the H22 info.

I am helping a guy get his civic set up to tune. I think it's a 91. He's got a wideband in a bung and as soon as he hits wot, it goes down to 12:1, dropping farther as you approach redline. Take a look at the stock PM6 fuel maps. It goes to 86% duty cycle or something like that, for an engine with an anemic header and intake manifold. The same injectors are used in the Type-R with over 70HP more and they hit over 90% duty cycle with a little more pressure behind them. The same injectors will fuel a supercharger setup to about 8PSI. 5-6 PSI for smaller turbos.

It gets way rich.

And, the timing gets way pulled so you get results that look like Paris Hilton: Rich and Retarded.
 

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my name says Guest, but Im really a MEMBER
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Yup. Rushi is the source for the H22 info.

I am helping a guy get his civic set up to tune. I think it's a 91. He's got a wideband in a bung and as soon as he hits wot, it goes down to 12:1, dropping farther as you approach redline. Take a look at the stock PM6 fuel maps. It goes to 86% duty cycle or something like that, for an engine with an anemic header and intake manifold. The same injectors are used in the Type-R with over 70HP more and they hit over 90% duty cycle with a little more pressure behind them. The same injectors will fuel a supercharger setup to about 8PSI. 5-6 PSI for smaller turbos.

It gets way rich.

And, the timing gets way pulled so you get results that look like Paris Hilton: Rich and Retarded.
well this answers your question. That's a very good point that the c1 and c5 motors use the same 245cc injectors.

another things I noticed is with a small boosted setup, the stock exhaust didn't even fell like it was holding back the motor. and another thing, my bros gsr. He took all of his intake and exhaust shit off, when he got out of the game, and honestly it felt exactly this same. just quieter.

point, save your money for boost. boost actually make a shit load of power. or cam and high compression pistions.
 

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I wouldn't worry about it as long as you're not flooring it for a long time.

When I tuned my car with a b7/z6 mini-me, z6 intake manifold, AEM intake, and a 2-3/8" exhaust - with a stock muffler and cat - I was getting about 13.9:1 at WOT. That was with a p28 basemap. Although, I did pull a fair amount of timing, which would make it read a little leaner.
 
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