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Old 02-22-2013, 02:15 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Evans Powersports Waterless Coolant

I stumbled upon this while going through some Darton MID literature. the product's USPs seemed interesting.

1. good for a lifetime.
2. does not pressurize like normal coolant / water mixtures. so radiator caps and hoses don't deteriorate much.
3. does not cavitate. as a result, preserves the water pump.
4. has an operating range from -40*C to 180*C. hence it does its job in pretty much every extreme condition an engine can face.

it looked quite tempting. I dug some more and read in some places that in low capacity cooling systems, the Evans coolant results in slightly higher core temperatures owing to the higher specific heat of a pure mixture of glycols [85% propylene glycol, 15% ethylene glycol] vs a regular mixture of ethylene glycol plus water. this did not seem like a problem for our cooling systems though.

further digging revealed that Evans had a dealer in India.
so I set about contacting him and ordered a carton of the stuff to test on my car.

after it arrived, I set about draining my radiator and blowing out the rest of the coolant in the block and pipes using an electric blower connected to the top radiator hose. Evans says it is imperative that there be as little water in the system as possible [up to a maximum of 3% water by volume].
reconnected everything and filled up around 1.25 gallons of Evans and hoped for the best.

after five days of running around with it, here are my observations:

1. there *is* pressure built up in the system, but nowhere even close to the pressure built up by regular water / antifreeze. I can stop a fully heated up engine and immediately pop the radiator cap as long as I am careful to avoid a little bit of hot coolant spewing out [100 ml at most], whereas doing the same thing with regular water / antifreeze mixture would blast me in the face with assorted stuff.
2. core temperatures are the same as before, presumably because of a full size radiator.
3. temperatures stay steady between 81*C and 86*C under all ambient conditions when the car is on the move. the fan is set to activate around 90*C, so I can theoretically keep cruising all day without needing the fan to kick in. when the car is standing still, however, the temps rise until the fans kick in.

overall, I am happy I tried this out and the other car will also be getting a dose of Evans after its engine rebuild. the stuff is as expensive as fully synthetic engine oil here, but considering how it is good for life and can be reused between engines, I feel it is worth the money.

I didn't come across many comprehensive reviews of this stuff when I was looking, hence this review. hope it helps somebody who may be in my position later.
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Old 02-22-2013, 05:50 AM   #2 (permalink)
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I looked into this stuff a while back. Don't they recommend that you use a faster water pump than normal, and use a modified radiator?

I'm doing a little research on the NPG stuff because you sparked my interested again.
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Old 02-22-2013, 05:56 AM   #3 (permalink)
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I believe that recommendation is for cases where the stock system is barely adequate.

I don't think our cars have that problem, especially with proper full size radiators.

I haven't seen the slightest hint of misbehavior until now. but then, I am also not pushing the engine anywhere near what you folks are. in a few weeks, I will be placing some additional load on the system by running a coolant - engine oil heat exchanger. it should be interesting to note what happens then.

also, if I remember correctly, NPG and Powersports have different formulations.
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Old 02-22-2013, 06:02 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Hmmm thanks for posting. Interesting stuff. Is it more dense then normal coolant?
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Old 02-22-2013, 06:03 AM   #5 (permalink)
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yup. a little like cold 0 weight oil.
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Old 02-22-2013, 06:18 AM   #6 (permalink)
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i've come back from my research conflicted and skeptical (maybe why I didn't try it initially). I'm interested to see how it works with the heat exchanger
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Old 02-22-2013, 06:24 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xylocramer View Post
i've come back from my research conflicted and skeptical (maybe why I didn't try it initially).
care to elaborate?
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Old 02-22-2013, 06:49 AM   #8 (permalink)
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I saw people saying they would never use it, I saw people saying they would never NOT use it, I saw people saying it was good for DD's but not race applications. I saw people saying it smells terrible and if you have a leak it's almost unbearable. I saw people saying they were getting temp readings of 300*F with the AC on going up hill. I saw people saying it never got over 190*F for them. People that had run it for ?6? years and never had an issue, people that had used it for a month and switched back to normal coolant.
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Old 02-22-2013, 06:57 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xylocramer View Post
I saw people saying they would never use it, I saw people saying they would never NOT use it, I saw people saying it was good for DD's but not race applications. I saw people saying it smells terrible and if you have a leak it's almost unbearable. I saw people saying they were getting temp readings of 300*F with the AC on going up hill. I saw people saying it never got over 190*F for them. People that had run it for ?6? years and never had an issue, people that had used it for a month and switched back to normal coolant.
heh. then I saw most of what you saw and decided to see for myself.

I can tell you that the vapors smell sickeningly sweet.

as for the rest, only time will tell. I will be doing a long 900 km drive tomorrow and the sun will be beating down. should be good testing conditions.

besides that, I will also be carrying some of this stuff to use in a friend's remapped Chevy Cruze diesel. the results from that experiment should also be interesting and informative.
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Old 02-22-2013, 06:58 AM   #10 (permalink)
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in for results
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Old 02-22-2013, 07:45 AM   #11 (permalink)
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I was skeptical at first but now I'm interested in the results.
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Old 02-22-2013, 09:23 AM   #12 (permalink)
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I use Evans NPG-R in my road race car and love it. Apparently however they no longer carry NPG-R and instead now have a product to replace it called NPG "High Performance".

One of my distributors carries the entire Evans Line. PM me if anyone is interested in ordering some.

OP, I am curious why you are running the Powersports formulation in your car instead of the NPG.

Also, to anyone who wants to use it: As the OP described you must thoroughly drain the Ethylene Glycol/Water based coolant ENTIRELY from your system. That includes draining the block and also the heater core.

It does smell different than normal coolant, but I dont consider it to be "sickening" by any means.
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Last edited by Atmosfear; 02-22-2013 at 09:43 AM.
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Old 02-22-2013, 09:30 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atmosfear View Post
OP, I am curious why you are running the Powersports formulation in your car instead of the NPG.
I figured that if it was good for motorsport applications, it would work for normal usage as well.

plus Powersports was the only product the dealer had. apparently it is his first shipment from Evans and I am their first customer.


Quote:
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It does smell different than normal coolant, but I dont consider it to be "sickening" by any means.
the liquid hardly smells. in vapor form, I found it pretty strong.
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Old 02-22-2013, 09:40 AM   #14 (permalink)
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@Atmosfear, I am curious about what happens in the rare case when a significant amount of water mixes with the Evans coolant.

does it damage anything or simply shrink the operating temperature range, creating a potential for damage?

can the mixed water be separated from the glycol by letting it evaporate with the radiator cap off and the engine running?
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Old 02-22-2013, 09:52 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 007 View Post
I figured that if it was good for motorsport applications, it would work for normal usage as well.

plus Powersports was the only product the dealer had. apparently it is his first shipment from Evans and I am their first customer.
If its all they had then so be it. Dont confuse "Powersports" however with "Motorsports". The powersports formulation is intended for motorcycles, ATV's, snow mobiles, dirtbikes, etc. Obviously though it still works for automotive applications if you are using it with no issues.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 007 View Post
@Atmosfear, I am curious about what happens in the rare case when a significant amount of water mixes with the Evans coolant.

does it damage anything or simply shrink the operating temperature range, creating a potential for damage?
I called Evans before I ordered a few cases of it for my race team and discussed this with them. They said that no harm will result from mixing it with water or standard coolant. The only negative effects will be that the Evans mixture would be "compromised" and can only be expected to perform as well as a standard 50/50 coolant/water mixture. The only way I see it performing WORSE than a standard coolant is if you had more water than coolant medium, in which case any coolant would perform worse as you are lowering the boiling point.

I have not personally mixed the stuff with water myself so I cannot verify the above to be 100% fact.
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Last edited by Atmosfear; 02-22-2013 at 10:01 AM.
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Old 02-22-2013, 09:55 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atmosfear View Post
If its all they had then so be it. Dont cinfuse "Powersports" however with "Motorsports". The powersports formulation is intended for motorcycles, ATV's, snow mobiles, dirtbikes, etc. Obviously though it still works for automotive applications if you are using it with no issues.
understood.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Atmosfear View Post
I called Evans before I ordered a few cases of it for my race team and discussed this with them. They said that no harm will result from mixing it with water or standard coolant. The only negative effects will be that the Evans mixture would be "compromised" and can only be expected to perform as well as a standard 50/50 coolant/water mixture.
I figured this would be the case. thanks for confirming.


PS: the long trip has been postponed by a day because I don't think I will get much sleep tonight.
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Old 02-22-2013, 06:59 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Of course, no dealers in Hawaii! Awesome how you can get it in India lol
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Old 02-22-2013, 10:29 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Of course, no dealers in Hawaii! Awesome how you can get it in India lol
until I actually called up the guys and talked to them, I was in disbelief myself.

what's more, I got the stuff at almost the same price as advertised on the US site.


EDIT:
I was surfing randomly and found some information about the stuff that constitutes these coolants.

Quote:
Originally Posted by http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/ethylene-propylene-glycol-d_904.html
Quote:
Originally Posted by http://www.dow.com/heattrans/support/selection/ethylene-vs-propylene.htm
In most heat transfer applications ethylene glycol-based fluids are your best choice because of their superior heat transfer efficiency. This efficiency is largely due to the lower viscosity of ethylene glycol solutions. Another benefit of this viscosity advantage is lower power consumption for re-circulation pumps and a lower minimum operating temperature

Propylene glycols are most commonly used in applications in which low acute oral toxicity is required, or for freeze protection where incidental contact with drinking water is possible. In some areas, use of propylene glycols is required by local regulation.
here are a few MSDS links:
Powersports: http://blackworks.in/cars/resources/...owersports.pdf
NPG+: http://blackworks.in/cars/resources/MSDS/Evans_NPG+.pdf
NPG-R: http://blackworks.in/cars/resources/...vans_NPG-R.pdf

I doubt the legitimacy of the NPG MSDS information though. NPG stands for Non-aqueous Propylene Glycol and yet, the MSDS says it is straight ethylene glycol. I *think* they meant propylene glycol.

@Atmosfear, can you please talk to Evans and confirm?
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Old 03-01-2013, 11:26 AM   #19 (permalink)
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OK. results:

this stuff is great. 850 km non stop on a hot day and bar a little mishap, the coolant temperature never rose over 86*C at low speeds and 84*C at high speeds.

details of mishap: I was playing with the maps while driving and at some point, lost the overall enrichment I had applied to the base Z6 map and the engine was running super lean as a result. so lean that it was running 15:1 at full load and 16:1 at low load. I had to pull an emergency overtake maneuver and as a result of a WOT period at 15:1, the head gasket developed a very tiny leak and began pressurizing the coolant jacket at high RPMs.

almost half a liter of coolant overflowed as a result and the temperature went up to 91*C and stayed there once the fans kicked in.

the head gasket will be changed tomorrow. once that is done, I shall test some more and update.
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Old 03-02-2013, 05:41 AM   #20 (permalink)
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In for updates. Will you need to change out the coolant or is it still good to use?
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