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Old 02-21-2005, 09:12 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Uberdata/Crome/Turboedit FAQ

USB Datalogging Driver : http://www.pgmfi.org/twiki/pub/Home/...s/USBDrive.zip


Uberdata/Chrome/Turboedit D-series.org FAQ
By makku


What do they do?

These are ECU ROM editing programs. Uberdata and Chrome are competing editors for OBD1 style ECUs and Turboedit is for OBD0 style ECUs. (see below for a list of common ecus) In the basic form, they allow you to edit the fuel and ignition maps of the ecu as well as various settings like the rev limit, vtec setpoints, speed limiter, etc. (They CANNOT change auto transmission shift points)

Currently, OBD2 ecus CANNOT be chipped by regular people. You're SOL unless you convert your car to using an OBD1 ecu using a harness adapter. Beware, this mod is illegal in CA and possibly other states.

These programs edit the ROM that you store on an external chip. So if your ecu has been “chipped” the ROM on the chip you’re running has been most likely edited by one of these programs.

Common ECUs:

OBD1

p28 – 92-95 Civic EX/Si
p06 – 92-95 Civic DX/LX
p08 - 92-95 Civic Ferio (jdm d15b vtec)
p30 – 91-95 B16 ecu
pr4 – 91-95 Integra LS
p72 – 91-95 Integra GSR

OBD0

PM6
PM7
PS9

(there are many different OBD0 ecus, some are easy to chip, some are not… as a general rule, 90-91 ecus are easily chippable, but 89 and below can be hard sometimes… consult pgmfi.org for more info.)


Why would I need to run Uberdata/Chrome/Turboedit myself?

If you plan on doing heavy modification to your engine, such as a turbo, supercharger, high compression, etc… anything that requires “fuel management”, you might want to start using one of these programs. It is the “best” because not only will it allow you to tune your car much more precisely than something like a V-AFC, but it’s very, very cheap compared to Hondata or an AEM EMS. Despite what some people claim, it is JUST AS EFFECTIVE as these more expensive tools.

Be aware... Uberdata/Chrome/Turboedit are NOT piggybacks or standalones. They are considered fuel management ONLY because you use them to modify your ecu for new fuel settings. They do NOT have to be run permanently in your car off a laptop. Once the ECU is tuned, you can put your laptop away and drive just like it was stock. The S-AFC and V-AFC need to be there permanently and can be easily stolen (plus, they suck at fuel management compared to edited the ECU). The AEM EMS is nice, but again, needs to be there permanently... it can be stolen.

What do I need to use these programs?

Minimum Requirements

1. Your ecu must be chipped! You can ask someone on this site to chip your ECU… there are many who do it (I’ll advertise myself and Civic4ges for now). Or, you can read up on pgmfi.org and learn how to do it yourself. Chipping won’t be covered in this sticky.

2. You must have a chip burner! This is a piece of hardware that lets you write the ROM that you will have edited onto a chip to place into your ecu. There are many popular chip burners… some are very user friendly and intended just for ECUs. (these can be pricey). I have a Willem basic EEPROM programmer that works just fine (Ebay $40). Do some research before you buy it and make sure it burns the type of chips you want it to burn! They almost always connect to a printer port... with a separate power cord for power or sometime USB for power. (this is more convenient for laptops)

3. You must have one of these programs: Uberdata, Chrome, or Turboedit. If you have obd1, play around with both uberdata and chrome and see which you like better. If you have obd0, you must use turboedit

Downloads:

Uberdata- www.uberdata.info

Chrome – http://forum.pgmfi.org/viewforum.php...0dad64aa802ea4
(the password for the zip file can be found in the chrome forum)

Turbedit - http://www.turboedit.org/

4. You must have a base ROM to edit. Some of these programs come with stock ROMs from various ECUs. If none of them have what you want, you can check pgmfi.org’s site for other roms.
http://www.pgmfi.org/twiki/bin/view/Library/EcuDefinitionCodes


Now that you have all of this, you have the ability to edit a ROM, burn it onto a chip and place it into your ECU. Next, I will cover all the extras you can use to really tune your car yourself.
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Old 02-21-2005, 09:55 PM   #2 (permalink)
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If you've followed the instructions above, you can now burn chips for yourself. Any modifications you make will have unknown power gains or losses though. You can't tell what effect changing the fuel or ignition values will have on your engine. Most people just go to a dyno and run their car at wide open throttle to see how much HP you get. You can change the maps and run it again... see if you've gained or lost hp over certain RPMs.

There is a better way to do this though! One is using datalogging!

What does datalogging do and how do I get it?

Datalogging is monitoring and recording your car's built-in sensors while the engine is running. There are two ways to do this.

One is by using a MAX233 or MAX232 board to convert your ECU's signals to something that can be read by a laptop computer. You can see an example of this in Civic4ges's product review thread on ecu chipping. There is a serial port coming out of the side of the ecu that you can connect to a laptop.

The 2nd way is to use a USB cable wired into your ecu. A Nokia phone dataconversion cable is modified to do this. Instead of a serial port, you get a USB connection that will work the same way. The method you choose is based on what type of connection you have on your laptop. Most laptops have USB... some of the really older ones only have serial... so it's up to you.

If you want datalogging for you ecu, PM me or civic4ges.

Both Uberdata and Chrome have datalogging software built into the program. Basically, as you drive your car, it will log the voltage of your stock o2 sensor at the RPM and manifold pressure you're at. If you're at wideopen throttle, usually your manifold pressure will be close to 1 bar (1000 mbar). So if your rpm is currently at 4000 rpm, the value of your o2 sensor will be recorded into the grid at 4000rpm and 1000mbar. When you've completed filling in the table over a range of rpms, you can go back and look at the o2 sensor readings to see if you're rich or lean at those points and go and adjust your fuel values accordingly. Then you burn the new map onto a chip and try running your car again!

Simple? Yes! However, datalogging with just your stock o2 sensor is not the best way to go because your stock o2 sensor just tells you if you're lean or rich... not how much. So you can't tell if you're very rich or very lean. What's next? Wide-band o2 sensor!

Why use a wideband o2 sensor?

The previous paragraph pointed out the weakness of using a stock o2 sensor (narrow-band). Uberdata and chrome both allow you to use aftermarket wide-band o2 sensors and controllers to tunr your car. Please, check each program specifically for which wideband o2 sensors they support.

Once you have a wideband sensor, you can do the same type of datalogging, but it will be MUCH more accurate. You can really get a good tune out of your car this way.

What else can Uberdata/Chrome/Turboedit offer?

Besides the ability to edit your fuel/ignition maps and change various settings, the authors of each program have special functions you can add to your ecu.

1. FTL (full throttle launch) - this is a special rev limit which is only active when the car is not moving. Basically, you can push the accelerator all the way in and your car will stay at the rpm you set... when you let out the clutch your car will launch and once moving, the special rev limit will return to the normal rev limit you have set.

2. Changing fuel injector sizes - All of the editors allow you to easily change your maps to allow for different size injectors. This is VERY important if you want to run very large injectors. If you just install them into your car without changing the fuel map, you will be dumping more fuel into your engine than you need.

3. Turbo settings - All of the editors allow you to expand your fuel/ignition maps PAST 1000mbars... turbos actually put positive pressure into your manifold and you need a map that allows you to change fuel and ignition settings for those conditions as well. They even allow you to change MAP sensors from the stock Honda map sensor which goes up to about 12 psi to a GM 3 bar map sensor. If you put even a small turbo on the car without modifying your ROM, the ecu will throw a code because it normally doesn't like to see boost pressure... these editors will take care of that.

There's even more stuff these do...
Turboedit and Uberdata allow you to create a "shift light" out of your Check Engine light. Turboedit even has a sort of traction indicator conversion for your CEL. Install one of these programs and browse the options to see what you can do.

What are the real differences between all of these editors?

Besides the obvious... Turboedit is for obd0 and Uberdata/Chrome is for obd1, there's not too much difference.

These are all works in progress. They all work just fine... the authors are always adding new features. In basic form, they all do the same thing, so really it's just which one you like using better. They all have support forums for questions. Uberdata is probably a little bit more popular than Chrome at the moment, but Chrome is rapidly gaining support because the user interface is really much nicer.

Uberdata's ROM code is based on a p72 (GSR ecu). Chrome's ROM code is based on a p30 (b16 ecu). Both will work fine in any ecu... even a non-vtec p06.
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Old 02-21-2005, 10:12 PM   #3 (permalink)
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What kind of chips do I need to buy to burn?

There are several options here. I used to use 27c256 chips (28-pin DIP or CDIP package!!! important!!!). These are sometimes UV eraseable, sometimes non-eraseable. They're cheap and exactly what the ecu expects. They're also hard to find now because no one makes them anymore. Also called EPROM chips.

Other types are 29c256 chips. These are called EEPROM. The extra "E" means electronically eraseable. They're basically flash memory... like what you find in computers. Can be more expensive... also somewhat hard to find. There's a company selling chips called 27SF256... which are basically the same as 29c256 chips.

Besides the size of the chip... which is what 256 refers to... you need to make sure the chip is fast enough to keep up with the ECU. The smaller the number, the better... from my experience, if it's 150 ns or better, you're good to go. This number usually comes after the chip type. For example, 27c256-120. This is a 27c256 chip that operates at 120ns. Good.

Again, any chip you get must be a DIP style 28-pin package. There are other packages which are either square shaped chips or just tiny... they won't fit. CDIP or PDIP is fine... one just means ceramic, the other means plastic.
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Old 02-23-2005, 10:56 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Turboedit QUICK GUIDE

Turboedit works mainly with PM6 code. Basically, all the special tricks work only if you are using the special PM6 code that the authors have created... which you can download from the site. (Currently, it is called ng60.bin... look for it in the turboedit forum on pgmfi.org) Fear not! PM6 code works on the majority of obd0 ecus. There are some though that don't work so well... check pgmfi.org for comments and lists of what is known to work well and what doesn't.

Turboedit will also READ and let you EDIT basic pm7 code. So if you want to keep the pm7 code on your pm7 ecu, you can.

1. Open Turboedit

2. Open a ROM (bin file) you downloaded from pgmfi.org

3. You will see two windows pop-up... one for fuel and one for ignition.

The fuel map contains a column of rpm numbers on the left and a row of manifold pressure (InHg - inches of mercury) numbers on the top. The other numbers are the fuel values... I believe the default numbers are the times the injectors stay open (shoot fuel). You can change this to show duty cycle (percentage of time they are open before they have to fire again) by right clicking on the map and selecting the option. Each fuel value is for the rpm row they are in and the manifold pressure column they are in.

Example - in STOCK PM6 code, the value at 26 InHg (basically, close to vacuum... throttle almost closed) and 5300 rpm is 2.07. So when you're driving near 5300 rpm and your foot is barely on the accelerator, your injectors are opening for 2.07 ms each time they fire. The duty cycle is 9% which means that they are open for 9% of the time and closed for 91% of the time. (Duty cycles over 80% are going to wear out your injectors.. be carefull)

The same goes for the ignition map. However, the numbers represent the number of degrees advanced (i think it's degrees). Some are negative... this just means retarded. And this is all based on what your distributor is manually set at... so set it at stock when you start to mess with these!

Just click on one to change it... type in a new value. Or drag select a bunch with the mouse and change them all at the same time. Highlight a few, right-click and select "Edit Region". You can then change all the values by a percentage, a set amount, whatever.

4. Finally, if you're using special PM6-based code, click on the Properties button (or select it in the menu). This is where the gold is!

You can add a bunch of cool features! Many of them are self-explanatory so I'll let you discover them. The ones I will explain are not as easy to figure out.

Fuel Multipliers - You don't really need to modify these. Basically, all the fuel values in the map are stored as 2 different numbers. What you see in the turboedit fuel map is the actual fuel value stored in the ecu MULTIPLIED by one of those fuel multipliers you see in the option screen. Each multiplier corresponds to a column in the map. So don't mess with it... it's not necessary for most people.

Fuel injector sizing - A stock map will assume stock 240cc injectors. You want to use 450cc injectors. OK, select it and hit apply. ONLY ONCE!!! it will reduce the fuel values. But if you hit it again, it will reduce them AGAIN. Not good.

Boost Options - if you're using the special PM6 code, you'll notice there are way more columns in the maps. That's for the boost areas. (positive pressure) This lets you use a function called boost cut... which I don't know much about. READ the turboedit forums... please. If you don't want the extra boost map, you can select NA tune (single map) at the top of the options box.

5. OK, say you want to do something simple. You want to use stock pm7 maps in the special pm6 rom. Well, open TWO turboedit programs. Open a ROM in each... and copy & paste. Easy!

Finally, when you burn the new ROM onto a chip and test it out on your car, be REASONABLE and let it idle first. See if it throws a code... check the code if it does.
If not, rev it a little... again check for codes.
Drive it slow... listen for DETONATION. Take it easy and you won't kill your motor.
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Old 02-23-2005, 11:01 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Learned alot from this thread. Thanks makku.
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Old 02-24-2005, 08:36 AM   #6 (permalink)
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good stuff i learned a lot

i had a randmo idea...instead of going on a dyno, would it be possible to tune the car sitting on a driveway with jackstands in the front? with a laptop and datalogger and everything?
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Old 02-24-2005, 11:43 AM   #7 (permalink)
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obd0 - how to get VTEC activation with your ecu!

1-wire vtec, 2 ways to do it:

1. Original way was to use an automatic obd0 ecu (90-91) like the ps9 from the civic EX or just convert a pm6 to automatic. Then vtec runs off the automatic lockup solenoid pin on the ecu. Turboedit has an option to select to enable this feature.

Advantage - get to keep A/C

Disadvantage - no more automatic, ps9's are hard to find, converting pm6s to automatic is a pain in the butt.

2. New way is to use ANY obd0 ecu (90-91 again!) and tap into the A/C clutch pin on the ecu. This means you lose A/C if you had it... IN ADDITION, you must wire in a relay. This is simple though...
(pic stolen from pgmfi.org)
This won't be inside the ecu... anywhere in your engine bay will do. Just to clarify.
1. ECU a/c clutch pin goes to signal
2. 12V from any source to the input
3. output goes to vtec solenoid
4. 12V from the same source goes to the other side of the signal

Advantage - VERY easy to make a pm6 do this. Just takes a click of the mouse in turboedit.

Disadvantage - no more A/C, must wire in a relay (that's really not hard though)

DON'T FORGET to modify your fuel and ignition maps to include the low and high cam portions of the original maps. For example, for a z6 engine, if you have vtec set at 5000rpm, enter the low cam fuel values from a p28 for all rpm values 5000 and below. Enter all the high cam fuel values from a p28 for all rpm values above 5000rpm. You'll have to get creative because you'll notice that the obd0 ecu doesn't have the same rpm resolution that a p28 has. If the rpm # on the obd0 ecu is in between a p28 rpm value, just take the average of those two fuel values.

It'll be some work, but you'll eventually find the perfect tune or just search around on pgmfi.org. Someone probably has uploaded something similar. But that's not the point of this sticky, is it?
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Old 02-25-2005, 06:03 PM   #8 (permalink)
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First I would like to say, Great write-up. In the Turboedit quick guide section you mentioned special PM6 base code. Where can I download a copy?
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Old 02-26-2005, 04:09 PM   #9 (permalink)
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i edited the writeup... take a look ^^^^^^

I'm gonna finish the Turboedit part with datalogging pretty soon... then get to work on the specifics for Uberdata/Chrome...
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Old 03-01-2005, 09:48 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Good stuff...new code out for TurboEdit today!

http://forum.pgmfi.org/viewtopic.php?t=4853
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Fuel Management for the Do-It-Yourselfer in mind
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Old 03-01-2005, 09:55 PM   #11 (permalink)
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very nice write-up makku. great job man
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Old 03-02-2005, 08:20 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Someone should change 'CHROME' to 'CROME' in the title before John Cui gets pissed.
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Old 03-02-2005, 10:32 PM   #13 (permalink)
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oh shit, I never noticed that... is it supposed to be an acronym then because otherwise it's a retarded spelling
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Old 03-02-2005, 10:49 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by xenocron
Someone should change 'CHROME' to 'CROME' in the title before John Cui gets pissed.
nah john is an overall nice guy, but he needs more encouragement to get nitrous controll built in then maybe i might consider crome
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Old 03-03-2005, 02:04 AM   #15 (permalink)
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you can always experiment with your setup... I have an idea, don't know if it will work. Basically, setup your ecu with a dual ROM chip (512k chip, not 256k)

Burn a normal map on the first half, then burn the same rom but with a map assuming you have nitrous ON all the time (retarded timing, maybe more fuel)

Have a transistor built into your nitrous activation button that switches the dual ROM program from the 1st to the 2nd program. It might work, it might not.... people have had success switching the maps while the car is on. I don't know what happens if the car is trying to read the map while it's being changed though. That's the experiment.
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Old 03-03-2005, 03:46 AM   #16 (permalink)
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i want to say THANK YOU!!!!!

very good right up!!!!
keep schoolin us dummies so we can be turbocharged with reliability!!!!
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Old 03-03-2005, 06:10 AM   #17 (permalink)
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^^^ Yeah, good writeup!!!!

One thing with crome I'm not too sure of are boost tables using a p28 stock map. It does not give me the option for boost, only when I use a p30 map. So what I did was copy and paste the p28 fuel and ignition tables for the high and low cam, into a p30 map and then added boost tables. Is this cool?
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Old 03-03-2005, 06:15 AM   #18 (permalink)
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yeah, maybe I didn't explain that... but all the special functions of crome only work on p30 code. So start with that and copy the maps from anything else over it (don't forget to disable the knock sensor in the options)
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Old 03-03-2005, 05:59 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I think this write-up has convinced me to get into this. I have a few questions after looking into a few things. If I'm datalogging then there's no need for a wideband right? Just a wideband o2, right? What is gonna be the real difference in eeprom burners? Software? Or is it that some don't work well? I would think it's all the same to data transfer this way, but yet I am just a noob. Thanks
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Old 03-03-2005, 07:27 PM   #20 (permalink)
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nope, you still need the wideband o2 controller... a stock ECU can't run a wideband o2.

Difference between eeprom burners is how many types of chips they can burn. Some do just the standard chips... some will do the special NVSRAM chips required for RTP. (i'll explain that later.) The Willem burner will do everything, but it doesn't come with instructions and it looks like a circuit board you'd stick in a computer. The more expensive ones might have cases and come with instructions.... just do some research before you buy one.
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