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Old 06-26-2017, 12:17 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Crank angle sensor on an A6 block?

I've got a Civic RT4WD wagon with a 3 cylinder D16A6. (No compression on #3) It's burned oil for a while, so it was bound to happen.

Hitting the scrapyard soon and figuring I'm gonna Frankenstein the engine. I'm building this engine for FUEL ECONOMY. 120ish HP in a daily beater is plenty. If I wanna go fast, I hop on two wheels.

I'd like to use my A6 pistons with a Y8 head. That should net me about 10:1 compression which should do fine on 87 Octane.

I'd like to run Distributorless using a Megasquirt ECU and a D17 valve cover with coils on the plugs.

To do that, I would need a crank angle sensor on the block.

I know the D16Y8 has a sensor on the crank sprocket. Does the A6 block have that provision?

I don't want to run a D16Y8 block for a couple reasons:

1.) It's less for me to buy at the scrapyard.
2.) It's a gamble if it's gonna have the holes for the Left (driver's side) intermediate shaft.
3.) I've heard of oiling problems with the EK series blocks. I'll keep my A6 crank. Gonna have to keep my A6 oil pan and pickup anyhow, as it clears the exhaust and rear drivetrain.
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Old 07-01-2017, 08:42 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Use a Y8 timing belt cog with the timing wheel and a Y8 oil pump, plug the dip stick hole in the oil pump and figure out a timing cover.


Ive never done it but it should work.
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Old 07-07-2017, 12:44 PM   #3 (permalink)
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What timing cover.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:31 AM   #4 (permalink)
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I would assume Y8 or Y7, because the lower portion is setup for the oil pump. The rest should match up well enough.

Worst case scenario chop out some of the A6 timing cover and rivet a piece of aluminum back over it if you really want it sealed up.
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Old 07-08-2017, 02:37 PM   #5 (permalink)
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did this to my car. Y8 oil pan, Y8 pump modded for flow, and y8 crank trigger.

worked like a champ.

https://www.d-series.org/forums/showc...-d15b7-10.html

it is the diameter on the outlet of the y8 pump that is the problem. drill it out and you should be good. there is a whole thread out there on it.

it is an easy mod and you end up with an aluminum oil pan out of the deal.
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Old 07-10-2017, 05:32 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Mixing oil pumps from the Y7/Y8 series on the earlier blocks only has a small issue with sealing the pan, but usually you use a Y8/Y7 pan and you can fill in the spots with JB weld but if you have to use the A6 pan you might have a different issue. Just something to pay attention to when you assemble this back.

From this thread: https://www.d-series.org/forums/engin...ml#post4022489
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Originally Posted by rabid View Post
First is obvious. You need a y8 or y7 oil pump. Second you need the timing belt cover and dipstick setup from the y8 or 7. Then you need to plug off the hole where the dipstick used to go through the block. (I used honda bond and a small bolt)

Now for the part that tripped me up the first time. The z6 rear oil seal had leaked like crazy around the pan seal and here is why.
20140705_140241 by rabidflickr, on Flickr

Here was the fix. I used jb weld metal putty to form a curve. Left it for one hour to cure and then shaped it with a die grinder and sandpaper.
20140705_162143 by rabidflickr, on Flickr
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Old 07-10-2017, 08:19 AM   #7 (permalink)
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you end up with an aluminum oil pan out of the deal.
No es bueno... I'm keeping the A6 oil pickup and pan to maintain the 4WD system.
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Old 07-15-2017, 09:42 AM   #8 (permalink)
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The A6 pickup and pan will work, but the Y8 oil pump might need slight altering to seal up well with the A6 pan. You would have to try to bolt them up to see if it will work or not. Does the Y8 pan not use a gasket? IIRC it uses a silicone bead.
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Old 07-15-2017, 09:50 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Silicone seal. If I remember correctly, there was an issue with the studs lining up correctly between the oil pump and the pan when I tried fitting the B7 pan on. Small issue if you have a welder.
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Old 08-08-2017, 02:09 AM   #10 (permalink)
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you can also buy/build a tone ring for the cam sprocket if you would rather not do all that bottom end work. something similar to this, then you can use the ring wizard in megasquirt to find the correct numbers.



or perhaps if you dont care about being able to adjust the cam timing, welding this to the stock cam sprocket would work very well.

https://www.diyautotune.com/product/...trigger-wheel/
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Old 08-08-2017, 11:44 AM   #11 (permalink)
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But never EVER use that piece of shit AEM 5 bolt cam gear....
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Old 08-08-2017, 06:35 PM   #12 (permalink)
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putting the trigger on the cam still doesn't make any sense.

if you're doing it off the cam, use the stock VR sensors

doing it off the crank is more accurate and really the only reason to even mess with it.

people have run at least 9s on the stock setup
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Old 08-08-2017, 09:47 PM   #13 (permalink)
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You can buy the 36-1 wheels on Ebay for cheap enough...bolt it to the crank pulley, easy peasy.

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Crank-trigger....c100005.m1851

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Old 08-09-2017, 01:14 PM   #14 (permalink)
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fixed it for ya bone. send rep to sailor for the tip
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Old 08-12-2017, 08:39 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shoebox_civic View Post
putting the trigger on the cam still doesn't make any sense.

if you're doing it off the cam, use the stock VR sensors

doing it off the crank is more accurate and really the only reason to even mess with it.

people have run at least 9s on the stock setup
The main reason I see why is to avoid the issues from cam flex. You dont think its happening, but that fucker is resonating and doing some crazy shit and twisting at higher engine speeds. Putting the sensor on the driven side of the cam will reduce that a lot.
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Old 08-12-2017, 08:56 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Putting on the crank eliminates. Cam twisting and belt strech issues. Heavy valve springs and big cams make this worse.
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Old 08-23-2017, 08:31 AM   #17 (permalink)
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A lot of good options here.

I was shying away from the Y8 oil pump due to the lack of volume/pressure over the A6 and Z6 pumps.

The ring that bolts to the cam sprocket or crank pulley is cheap and does the trick.

I just figure if I'm not using the distributor, why even have it. It's just another thing to clutter up the engine bay. Coil-On-Plug is cleaner and more efficient.
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Old 08-23-2017, 02:36 PM   #18 (permalink)
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You dont need timing cover

Belt flexes more than any metal does.

Crank timing is better.

Both is best.

Look at production D17 .Fluctuation is good to know.,
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Old 08-23-2017, 05:42 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FarmerD View Post
The main reason I see why is to avoid the issues from cam flex. You dont think its happening, but that fucker is resonating and doing some crazy shit and twisting at higher engine speeds. Putting the sensor on the driven side of the cam will reduce that a lot.
yes, better, but I think the belt is inducing more slop than a solid piece of steel.

honestly there's probably more slop in the dizzy drive to the stock sensor than in the entire cam flexing, which the camgear pickup does eliminate

buuuuuut
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Putting on the crank eliminates. Cam twisting and belt strech issues. Heavy valve springs and big cams make this worse.
this is where I am - why go through the trouble to half fix it when it's the same amount of work to totally fix it?
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Old 08-24-2017, 02:54 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Both are important. What are you looking for. Piston position or air/valve position
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