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Old 07-21-2016, 05:16 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Built d series or stock b20 for circle track cars

I am building a 98 hatch circle track car. These our rules pertaining to motors

Engine Specifications:
Twenty five hundred (2500) cc maximum.
.04 maximum overbore will be allowed.
Expanded/Racing oil pans will be allowed.
Dry sump pumps will not be allowed.
After market pulleys will be allowed.
Aftermarket heads will not be allowed.
Roller valve train parts allowed only if OEM parts. No aftermarket. Maximum 480 lift camshaft All pistons will be allowed.
Connecting rods must be steel.
Variable valve timing will be allowed.
Knife edging cranks will not be allowed.
Maximum compression ratio is 12:1
Engine must be of same manufacture as chassis. Honda for Honda, Toyota for Toyota etc. Engine must fit chassis with no modification of motor mounts.

IGNITION
Any stock ignition or MSD will be allowed.
Fuel System:
A fuel cell is mandatory. Maximum twelve (12) gallon fuel cell, in a steel container with a check/rollover valve in the vent line; secured with two (2) straps front to rear and two (2) straps left to right. The minimum dimension of strap material is eighth (1/ inch x one and one half (1) inch.
All fuel filters must be of metal construction. No plastic, glass or other material will be allowed.
Any line containing a combustible material must be metal and routed outside of the driver compartment. Electric fuel pumps must be wired through a low oil pressure cut off switch.
Fuel Cell minimum ride height 8? from ground.


I am building a whole car so my budget for drivetrain for first year is tight. Looking for opinions on 1st would you swap in abseries motor and gsr trans. This swap will be most of my drivetrain budget due to torque I was looking at a b20b or build a dseries motor and apply savings into motor. Head cam pistons valve springs etc.

I understand with a endless budget bseries all the way but in my situation would the build d series motor outperform to stock b series set up ?

I am partial to d series I use to drag a 92 hatch with a turbod d16 loved that car.

Seeing rules maybe a few bench builds to get some ideas.
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Old 07-21-2016, 07:44 AM   #2 (permalink)
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With an endless budget and those rules, you'd be looking at a K series.

Maximum displacement wins everytime if there's no weight break.

"I am building a whole car so my budget for drivetrain for first year is tight."

I've said it before on here and I'll say it again . . . in circle track and road racing, the setup and the driver are WAY more important than making raw HP.

If your budget is really that small, then use a stock z6 or y8 and put the rest of the money/time in gutting the car, roll cage, suspension and your safety equipment.

Worry about a built motor next year, heck half the racing season is almost over at this point anyways.
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Old 07-21-2016, 08:30 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pro-SeriesFab View Post
With an endless budget and those rules, you'd be looking at a K series.

Maximum displacement wins everytime if there's no weight break.

"I am building a whole car so my budget for drivetrain for first year is tight."

I've said it before on here and I'll say it again . . . in circle track and road racing, the setup and the driver are WAY more important than making raw HP.

If your budget is really that small, then use a stock z6 or y8 and put the rest of the money/time in gutting the car, roll cage, suspension and your safety equipment.

Worry about a built motor next year, heck half the racing season is almost over at this point anyways.



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Engine must fit chassis with no modification of motor mounts.
might be the b reason ..
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Old 07-21-2016, 11:37 AM   #4 (permalink)
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yes k series is out of the picture. Car was just gutted yesterday we our starting build on cage next week. we do not plan on racing this year. Alot of guys our running integras we get a 50 pound break for running a sohc motor. budget for drivetrain is about $1500.I agree 100% you can have the biggest motor but gearing is the most important.
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Old 07-21-2016, 11:40 AM   #5 (permalink)
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you also get a 50 pound break if you dont run variable timing. But in a all out race motor why not just cam a non vtec head for upper rpms.
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Old 07-22-2016, 06:37 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maineracer View Post
yes k series is out of the picture. Car was just gutted yesterday we our starting build on cage next week. we do not plan on racing this year. Alot of guys our running integras we get a 50 pound break for running a sohc motor. budget for drivetrain is about $1500.I agree 100% you can have the biggest motor but gearing is the most important.
Then run a F22A.

Keep the SOHC and get more displacement.
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Old 07-22-2016, 10:21 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by robgoof View Post
might be the b reason ..
so if you welded an entire front clip off an rsx to a civic frame would that be within rules?
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Old 08-28-2016, 09:46 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Whatever you are doing, if you want to be competitive as NA, your best bet is always to try to get as close to the displacement limit as the rules allow. 2.5L in a civic is F-G-H K or maybe some crazy J build (not likely).

In your place I would be thinking h23 swap for now with an overbore, pistons and a headswap down the road.
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Old 08-28-2016, 09:52 AM   #9 (permalink)
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can't bore an H23.

G23 bored as much as you can is the only way to get that kind of displacement on a distributor headed honda
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Old 08-28-2016, 10:27 AM   #10 (permalink)
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lol, f22/3 block with k pistons and h22/3 head? sounds win
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Old 08-28-2016, 10:32 AM   #11 (permalink)
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lol, f22/3 block with k pistons and h22/3 head? sounds win
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Old 08-29-2016, 07:59 AM   #12 (permalink)
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B20 for sure, just because torque alone. Vtec head later.
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Old 08-29-2016, 04:53 PM   #13 (permalink)
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j30 swap, press sleeves into bores to change the bore size from 86 to 78.5 you could reach 2.49 theoretically. And seeing as many stock d16, b16, b18 and b20 combos are right in that size range im sure you could find something to fit the bill. it says you cannot overbore past .04 but it says nothing about under-boring.

Machining and pressing in those sleeves wouldnt be too hard either. and im sure you could pick up a stock j30 for cheap with the lsd 6 speed trans. Even better would be to cut the frame mounting points out of the originating car and weld them directly into your car wherever they land, defeating the "motor mount modification" rule.

If you want to stick with a 4 cylinder, get an h23 or b20 and stroke it to 2.5 by having it ground and hardwelded.
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