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Old 01-15-2006, 10:42 PM   #1 (permalink)
 
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Question cam gear questions

just a few questions..
background: i got me a JDM DOHC ZC motor with a pair of blue AEM adj. cam gears runnin in it...(bought the car with these on)...1 of em is advanced by 2degrees, and the 2nd one is at normal 0degrees.... i do not understand this..

1) what does advancing mean? whats it do?

2) what does retarding mean? what does it do?


--my 1st and 2nd gear take off like nutz!...but my 3rd,4th,and 5th gear...are slow at catching up.....

can go about 100 in 3rd @ 6kRPM...i rarely goto 5th gear....but anywho...
i need to know as much as possible about my cam gears... can you adjust them by losening the screws? or would u have to take off the belt // relieve tension? or what?



--goin nutz..my buddy in his cavelier with a 2.2L ECOtech engine beat me in a race...
---roxed his soxx through 1st and 2nd gear...but when we both reached 3rd gear..he was gawn!!....but was slowly creapin on him in 3rd.....but creapin' is not good enough for me...what should i do to my cams to make 1st,2nd, and 3rd gear OMGWTFPWNT anything??
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Old 01-16-2006, 12:56 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Advancing means your making the valves open earlier and retarding is making the valves open later....
If your useing a dx tranny that could be your problem the dx tanny has really tall gears and it takes awhile to get the engine back into it's power band...
Switching to a si tranny would help a lot... I'm running a zc tranny and the gearing in that is pretty agressive....
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Old 01-16-2006, 01:02 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Well, certain settings will net you more or less power in a given rpm range. It's really trial and error depending on your setup. Unless you can manage some time on a dyno, it's impossible to tell exactly. You can play around with it a little to see what "feels" best to you. Just don't deviate more than a couple degrees from Zero in either direction to be on the safe side, until you become more familiar with how it works. Just be sure to torque the adjustment bolts down before starting the motor after adjusting them. I think it's usually around 8-12 lbs-ft.
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Old 01-17-2006, 09:34 AM   #4 (permalink)
 
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hmm..i see....i got an si tranny in the crx....so i just unbolt the camgears and readjust it?....didnt realized it was an easy tune! unless i gotta remove the tension on the belt :P
should i mess with both the cam gears? or just 1? :P

can 1 be set at -1 and another be set at +2? or should it be 1 or the other... or should both be set?
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Old 01-17-2006, 11:51 AM   #5 (permalink)
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A better thing to try might be getting a msd cap and accel super coil for it... It' does take some wiring skills but it's worth getting the throttle responce and it deffinatly pulled harder in my car....
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Old 01-18-2006, 07:39 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtroy917
hmm..i see....i got an si tranny in the crx....so i just unbolt the camgears and readjust it?....didnt realized it was an easy tune! unless i gotta remove the tension on the belt :P
should i mess with both the cam gears? or just 1? :P

can 1 be set at -1 and another be set at +2? or should it be 1 or the other... or should both be set?
Adjust til your heart is content! When you go to move one, just loosen the bolts and turn your crank pulley SLOWLY with a wrench(with the car in neutral). This will move the gear. Be very careful moving the motor clockwise. Do so very slowly if you must. Turning the motor backwards is not recommended, but if you do it slowly and for very small distances, it shouldnt hurt anything. Just be sure to turn it counter clock wise a couple tooth lengths after adjusting to ensure the slack has been taken back out of the timing belt. Good luck tuning!!!
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Old 01-22-2006, 10:27 PM   #7 (permalink)
 
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bleh......i need help??? what should i adjust my exhaust cam to...and my intake came to?......i want to get the most power out of my car...without damaging the motor...
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Old 02-03-2008, 11:18 AM   #8 (permalink)
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up ;p
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Old 02-03-2008, 11:41 AM   #9 (permalink)
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dohc zc's are always off a tooth.. its strange the cams are setup like that.. the intake cam is always lined up and the exhaust cam is retarded a tooth...

thats what i would check first to make sure the cams are lined up right
this is what they look like stock


and heres how you get everything tdc



after you are sure that your cam gears are in the correct position then you can adjust them a few degrees here and there.. if you want more top end power you can retard your exhaust cam 2-3 degrees and advance your intake cam 2-3 degrees giving you some overlap but it helps in the top end but you will lack a little in the lower rpms...

i played around with my cam gears on my type r motor and i just adjusted them until i liked where the powerband was... wasnt really trying to make more power just wanted to adjust my powerband..

also remember if you adjust your intake cam, the same cam that has the distributor remember to adjust your distributor as well.. if you advance the cam retard the dizzy, if you retard the cam advance the dizzy, i recommend doing everything with a timing light for dizzy timing
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can you tell me how to hook up a vtech switch?
i want it on the new steering wheel i got at pep boys. have you seen it its sick!
but if i hook up the vtech i can have it at like whatever rpms i want right?
like vtech all the time? will it pop louder?
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Old 02-03-2008, 08:07 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Volitech View Post
Advancing means your making the valves open earlier and retarding is making the valves open later....
If your useing a dx tranny that could be your problem the dx tanny has really tall gears and it takes awhile to get the engine back into it's power band...
Switching to a si tranny would help a lot... I'm running a zc tranny and the gearing in that is pretty agressive....
Or make a hybrid, use your 4.25 final drive from the USDM Si and combine it with the JDM Si ZC cluster, then you have an evil little box.
Thats what i run behind my boosted ZC and it's awsome, easily my favourite part of the whole car.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Black91CRXsi View Post
Adjust til your heart is content! When you go to move one, just loosen the bolts and turn your crank pulley SLOWLY with a wrench(with the car in neutral). This will move the gear. Be very careful moving the motor clockwise. Do so very slowly if you must. Turning the motor backwards is not recommended, but if you do it slowly and for very small distances, it shouldnt hurt anything. Just be sure to turn it counter clock wise a couple tooth lengths after adjusting to ensure the slack has been taken back out of the timing belt. Good luck tuning!!!
I find it's easiest to leave the belt etc all as-is and loosen the bolts on the pully then put a cresent on the cam itself and rotate the cam.
When you have the cam lined up where you want it hold it there and get a mate to tighten up the pulley bolts again. (easier with two people)
There is a hexagonal section on the cam especially for this.

This should be done in gear with a bit of pressure forward on the car to keep the tension side of the cam belt tight so it will represent how the pullies will be when the engine is running.

You dont need to worry about keeping it at tdc or anything just adjust by the marks on the pully at whatever crank position you like.
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Old 02-04-2008, 06:57 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by siregcivic View Post
dohc zc's are always off a tooth.. its strange the cams are setup like that.. the intake cam is always lined up and the exhaust cam is retarded a tooth...
that statement is totally incorrect - the exhaust cam is not supposed to be off one tooth - the timing marks on the gears need to be lined up with each other and also lined up with the top of the head - having the exhaust cam off one tooth will result in poor engine performance and usually will cause a Check Engine Light with error code 9

this picture is from the Honda factory service manual on aligning the DOHC ZC gears:



this picture is from the Haynes manual:



this is how they should like when they are set correctly:

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Old 02-04-2008, 07:21 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtroy917 View Post
i got me a JDM DOHC ZC motor with a pair of blue AEM adj. cam gears runnin in it...(bought the car with these on)...1 of em is advanced by 2degrees, and the 2nd one is at normal 0degrees.... i do not understand this..
AEM doesn't make cam gears for the DOHC ZC - if it has AEM gears, they must be for B/H series engine, in which case the mark for aligning the exhaust cam is not in the right location - it is off one tooth and would need to be lined up like siregcivic is showing on the stock gears, although his stock gears are not correct - unless you have the head milled or the block decked or are running aftermarket camshafts, the DOHC ZC works best with both cams set at zero

this is where the exhaust cam gear mark should be when using B-series gears on the DOHC ZC - these are B-series gears with marks added for the ZC

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Old 02-04-2008, 08:30 AM   #13 (permalink)
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go ahead and set your cam gears the way a b swap would be set.. with them both pointing up.. lets see who loses power.. ill put money on it that you lose power setting it up like that, and not having the exhaust cam retarded a tooth... have you ever taken the valve cover off and looked at the cams alignment holes all you do is stick a drill bit in them like i have pictured.. then look at the cam gears the exhaust cam is retarded a tooth..

thats how they are setup... trust me i have been dealing with zc's before many people knew what a dohc zc was 9 years ago...

but you are free to put the cam gear wherever you want but if you lose power.. ill just say i told ya so

even on the jg gears the exhaust cam is back a tooth
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Quote:
can you tell me how to hook up a vtech switch?
i want it on the new steering wheel i got at pep boys. have you seen it its sick!
but if i hook up the vtech i can have it at like whatever rpms i want right?
like vtech all the time? will it pop louder?
Quote:
Just hook it up to a clapper and slap yourself in the face everytime you race......
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