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Old 10-07-2012, 03:28 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default DOHC ZC timing

Ok here is whats going on.
Im not doubting anyone at all but Im trying anything to get this car running


Here is what Im doing
Trying to get the 1 tooth off in the gears

This is speaking trying to get it one tooth off as follows.
Only way I can get it all tight is by liming up the lines on the gears. When its like that the UP marks arnt true at 12 oclock.
I have 124 tooth belt I counted it. Crank gear is dead on the arrow on the pump.
Ideas?

This is what im doing.
I set the tensioner all the way to the right towards the water pump and tighten the bolt.
put belt on the crank gear behind the tensioner the around the pump.
the from the left side i take the belt around the ex gear then to the IN gear.
Loosen the tensioner bolt, then all hell breaks loose lol. I try to get it tight and it just slips.


Here is how its supposed to look one tooth off


This is how I had it. Also this is the only way I can get the belt tight like it needs to be.
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Old 10-07-2012, 04:16 PM   #2 (permalink)
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why do you want it to be one tooth off? 9.7 degree andvance/retard on a stock cam?
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Old 10-07-2012, 04:20 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I don't understand how you are doing the belt. This is how you are suppose to do it:

-Take the crank pulley off and timing covers
-get the crank gear to TDC (arrow on pump and line on gear)
-Align the cam gears where you want (use the dowel trick to hold in place if you need)
-Leave tensioner bolt loose (just enough be able to move back and forth)
-Put belt on
-Pull the spring on and rotate the engine counterclockwise 3 teeth on cam gears or 1/4 turn on crank. Tighten the tensioner bolt and rotate and check timing.
-Never turn it clockwise
-Reinstall cover and crank pulley and that's it.

If you want to leave the crank pulley/belt on and just fix the timing.

-Get the crank to TDC with the belt still on.
-Loosen the tensioner bolt and pull the the belt off
-move the cam gears where you want them
-put the belt back on, making sure the crank pulley doesn't move when you are pulling on the belt.
-then with the tensioner bolt still loose, turn the crankshaft pulley counterclockwise 1/4 turn or 3 teeth on cam gears.
-tighten tensioner bolt and keep turning counterclockwise to check timing.

I did it both ways and never had a problem (probably had the timing belt off a DOHC ZC 10-15 times). Why do you wanna put it off one tooth?
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Old 10-07-2012, 04:38 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Cause I have heard both ways to do it and haven probs with this car. So Im trying both ways/

The pic above is from a running car with the one tooth off.

I used this
http://www.zcspeed.com/ZCtimingbelt.pdf
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Old 10-07-2012, 04:46 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I never had a problem using the bottom matk for TDC and the dowel holes and the 3 tooth method for tension.

My only variation was to manually help the tensioner with the dowels in and lock the tensioner, remove dowels, apply very gentle pressure with a spanner on the hex on the cam to take weight off the dowel if belt tension is locking them in. Be careful to be gentle as the cap is quite thin where the dowel hole is. Don't break it.

Turn engine 3 full turns counterclockwise by the crank so the belt aligns. If the belt looks like jumping a tooth, press down on the belt and cam gear. If there is slack still, loosen the tensioner a bit while holding a bit of pressure on the cam to pull the belt tight. Re-tighten the tensioner with no slack in the belt.

Turn the engine 3 full turns counter clockwise again until everything runs true. Keep checking marks. STOP and fix it if they look wrong by more than 1 tooth.

Bring to TDC loosen the tensioner do the 3 tooth trick then tighten again. This ensures the belt is aligned as it is tensioned.

If in doubt still, physically check your TDC mark.

If that is true but you still doubt the cam timing, physically check split overlap with 2 by 1" travel dial indicators.

Remember when 1 is TDC on power stroke, 4 is at TDC on overlap stroke and vice versa.
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Old 10-07-2012, 05:32 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Thanks Pat.

I did a leak down test with the belt on with marks lined at gears and the crank gear dead on with the arrow on the pump.

All 4 cylinders I only heard slight hissing from the pan via oil ports in the head.

Nothing in the pan or in the intake and radiator was free of bubbles.
I dont have a gauge to tell me percent of leakage to the pan"which i hear is normal to have some to the pan as not one motor is 100% air tight cause of the rings"

But Im guessig that all is good via the leak down test results.
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Old 10-07-2012, 07:29 PM   #7 (permalink)
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The only reason to put it one tooth off is B-series cam gears. I say did the vitara crap and put some OEM pistons in it. You might just wanna start fresh, seems like you spend way too much time trying to diagnosis it.
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Old 10-07-2012, 09:35 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Sure ill ditch it all. Come tear motor apart and buy all the parts i need



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Old 10-08-2012, 11:21 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepingciv View Post
Sure ill ditch it all. Come tear motor apart and buy all the parts i need



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Sure I'll make that bitch run right

I hope you get it all straightened out, but next time you have the engine out get some stock pistons and run low boost or get some RE forged pistons and boost the crap out of it. Or deck the block/head to get compression up to a more reasonable ratio. It won't ever run really good with that low of compression, but it should run a little better than it is now.
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