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Old 08-07-2006, 09:40 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Talking Building a powerfull d17

This is a write up for all of you 7thgener's out there. I figured theres one for the d16 wht not the d17.

First you need to set your goals for horsepower, steetablility and price. If you have tools and know how to work on a motor building you d17 will be a lot cheaper.

Exhaust- You need to pick out an exhaust and a header. Cat backs dont really matter because hardly any power is made. You probably want to use a 2.25 or 2.5 inch exhaust. Next youll need a header. It all depends on how much you want to pay. I would narrow it down to the dc race header and the less expensive hp race header. You will also need an o2 sim for these. Both these headers will be streetable but will not pass emmisions. The dcrh eliminates the cat and the hp you should get a test pipe for the best gains.

Intake- There are many combos and styles you can choose from. I would reccomend and ebay with k and n or if you want you could choose anything its up to you. YOu will need to swap to a horizontal intake manifold using the y8 intake manifold. You can also use an aftermarket intake manifold like skunk2 or an obx for the less pricey. I have heard of people using a b-series but it is more difficult. Make sure your throttle body matches your intake manifold and your runner ports match your intake ports.

Head work- Now there are many ways to do this first i would reccomend swapping to v-tec if you are not, you will also gain a little compression if you do the mini me. You have 3 choices for the cam. Crower stage 1-3. FOr driveability and price i would pick the stage one because you dont need to upgrade valvetrain. For those guys looking for 160-170 whp i would recommend stage 2 or 3. Stage 2 raises redlin 2000rpm and stage3 raises redline more than that. With an aftermarket cam you also need an aftermarket cam gear like aem. You will also need a port and polish ranging from mild to wild. If you are shooting for high horsepower you should also use larger valves.

Block- This part is optional depending on how far you are taking your build. You can raise compression using domed pistons from a civic gx to a 12.5 compression ratio. You can also use aftermarket pistons. Rods are not really neccesary for n/a builds. You should also use aem pulley kit. It will increase horespower slightly but you want to get as much as possible. You should probably leave the crank alone except for new bearings. You can use oem or aftermarket it doesnt really matter. For higher horsepower builds you should use arp studs from a d16z6.

Transmission- There are not many trhings you can do however i would reccomend an aftermarket clutch stages 1-3 and a lightened flywheel not less then 12lbs. The reason for this is the lighter flywheel will cause the revs to fall at a faster rate. You should also look into tranny mount and motor mount inserts. If you are shooting for lower track times you should get a revo ss.

Tuning- This vehicle is far off from the cheap stuff like uberdata. Once again it all depends on how far you are going if you dont use a cam then you can use a apexi vafc as a hack unit. If you are using a stage 1 or higher you will need either a greddy e-manage or better an aem full management. If it where me i would use an e-manage with a stage one just to keep costs down.
The emanage and aem allow you to fully tune timing and air fuel ratio. The aem also raises the redline 1000 more rpm so the stage two camshaft with a ems would net a 9000 rpm d17 motor.


Just to give you an idea this would be my build
2001 ex
custom short ram with k and n-60
y8 im and tb-80
port and polish-210
crower stage 1 cam-230
aem cam gear-110
diy grounds-7
ngk plugs-30
motor mount inserts-60
Rear section exhaust-100
Hp race header and straight pipe-300
Emanage-350
Tune-210= 3 hours on the wideband
about 1750 for my whole build. I hope this helps everyone make thier decisions on their builds. Im looking for 140 whp by the way.
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Old 08-07-2006, 09:44 AM   #2 (permalink)
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1750$ for 140whp is retarded
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Old 08-07-2006, 10:57 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Maybe but it goes back to the triangle. Its reliable and cheap.
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Old 08-07-2006, 11:03 AM   #4 (permalink)
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that really isnt bad for the 7th gen.. kind of hard for you guys to have any other options....
but good luck with the build!
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Old 08-07-2006, 01:16 PM   #5 (permalink)
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9000 RPM on a D17? a D16 barely survives it, a D17 def wont. This coming from someone who advocates high revving NA.

Also, 140 WHP in a EM2 is probably going to still run 16's.
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Old 08-08-2006, 03:22 AM   #6 (permalink)
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complete w2aste of money , thats almost 2000 towards a K swap.
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Old 08-09-2006, 10:31 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Actually this guy runs runs 15.5 off the bottle with 133whp he runs 14.1 on the bottle. Thats enough to beat a celica! And k-swaps are upwards of 7 grand saying you do it yourself. Id much rather only spend 2g's and then get a new car.
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Old 08-09-2006, 10:32 AM   #8 (permalink)
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ANd its 9000rpm thats y you need the valvesprings and retainers.
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Old 08-09-2006, 01:41 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkid15
Actually this guy runs runs 15.5 off the bottle with 133whp he runs 14.1 on the bottle. Thats enough to beat a celica! And k-swaps are upwards of 7 grand saying you do it yourself. Id much rather only spend 2g's and then get a new car.
it dose not cost 7 grand for a k swap shops do them for about 6 installed
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Old 08-09-2006, 04:37 PM   #10 (permalink)
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anyone thats good with cars or at least done a swap , could do a k swap to a 7th gen coupe. need alot of parts out of an RSX though. its virtually bolt in with aftermarket side mounts. front and rear mounts are on the cradle which will bolt right in to a 7th gen coupe.
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Old 08-10-2006, 12:08 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Its not bolt in with sidk20 intermediate shaft............................................. ...$220
Axles from 02+ si................................................ ........$100 from junkyard
RSX Subframe.......................................... ..................$600(quoted from acura)
Hasport Mounts............................................ ...............$400
Shifter Assembly.......................................... ...............$100
Shifter Cables............................................ ..................$300
02+ si radiator. i used the rsx radiator.......................$150 (TYC brand)
fans.............................................. ..................................$30 universal fan from autozone
02+ si upper radiator hose..........................................$13
02+ si lower radiator hose............................................$1 1
RSX Throttle cable............................................. .......... $40
RSX Fuel Line.............................................. .................$45
RSX Brake booster line.............................................. ..$45
RSX Purge Line.............................................. ...............$40
02+ si ac line from compressor to condensor.............$100
RSX Clutch Line From slave to master........................$20 from junkyard
RSX high pressure power steering hose.....................$240
RSX Power steering return line.....................................$50
92-95 Civic Power steering resevoir with bracket.......$50

Optional Stuff:
Hondata........................................... ................................about $900
Hasport/Hybrid Racing Engine Harness......................about 600
(complete new harness)
That is about 3800 for all the parts not including shipping and handling, tax or the motor. Shipping will be at least 300 w/out the motor including tax
The tax on the motor is 7% in New York i dont know about other places. And you have to buy the motor so
3800
300
+3100
7200

2500 for the si- 5000 for the type r but we will use the type s because i know i dont have type r's at my junkyard. SO about 3100 for that as quoted from a local junkyward when i was looking into a swap.
You could use an si motor but that wouldnt be worth the 6000 or so you would pay for the whole swap.
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Old 08-10-2006, 12:12 PM   #12 (permalink)
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This is without shipping or installation. Hey i think im with the newb! ohhh wait.... i am with the newb. And Neptuning just ask bambooseven how long it took him to and honda tuning to do their crx k swap. i know its different but itll give you a labor charge. At 75 bucks an hour i dont think any shop does a k swap for that much.
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Old 08-11-2006, 06:39 AM   #13 (permalink)
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i was going to go k series but changed my mind after the prices of just the motors.....i was going to go cheap and get a k out of an accord or crv and with doing all the work myself it was easily going to run at least 6k.....thats not even putting the rsx k in....which is about 4k just for the motor. in my opinion change the fuel system to a return system, do head work and port the exhaust ports on the d17 and boost....there is plenty of guys putting down 250-300whp on 7thgencivic.com and thats with stock valvetrain so imagine that with a cam and a wild port job.....boosted 7th gen all the way. the key is making a return fuel system, and that will open these engines big time!
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Old 08-11-2006, 09:34 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkid15
This is without shipping or installation. Hey i think im with the newb! ohhh wait.... i am with the newb. And Neptuning just ask bambooseven how long it took him to and honda tuning to do their crx k swap. i know its different but itll give you a labor charge. At 75 bucks an hour i dont think any shop does a k swap for that much.
considering my friends owns a shop and i know how much he charges for them they dont do them for that riggggghhhhtt.

by the way who would keep powersteering and ac with a k swap
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Old 08-11-2006, 11:15 AM   #15 (permalink)
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People who want to drive it in hot weather. Anyhow I have come across a great deal. I could sell my civic and pic up a cby accord.(1993) Those things do have potential especially for daily driving purposes. However i think that ill keep the civic for now. I do see where your going with the k swap i found out you can mod civic parts to fit the k and save up to 600 bucks. but that is not a realistic situation for me i dont even have a real job. Ive just saved my money for the past 4 years and managed to save like 5g's.
Neptuning i know your a smart guy and i apologize maybe my goes arent realistic but ill still try.
BTW what your take on nitrous with stock pistons.
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Old 08-11-2006, 11:39 AM   #16 (permalink)
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thanks man i like nitrous in your case with that year civic id just run a 75 shot wet kit on it get 2 step colder plugs you'll be set
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Old 08-11-2006, 03:25 PM   #17 (permalink)
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post me a link to a hondata unit for anything but OBD1 cars. i wanna see it. to my knoledge there isnt one. but i hope thier is.
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Old 08-11-2006, 03:34 PM   #18 (permalink)
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hondata kpro is what you run with k series
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Old 08-14-2006, 04:33 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I think you are just "planning and thinking".
First not any cam will rise your redline beacause it is limited by ECU. I recommend don't go more than 7500 RPM's. With longer stroke and the same rod, more forces are on the internal components of the engine. Refer to the rod/stroke ratio.

2nd Newton's Law
F=ma (force=mass*accelaration)

On a D16 with 90mm stroke and 137mm rod the max pistons accelaration at 7500RPM is 121002 fps2. On a D17 with 94.4 stroke and 137mm rod the max piston accelartion at 7500RPM is 128434fps2. (accels. from http://www.zealautowerks.com/dseries.html)

The DC race header is for "RACE" where the engine is at high rpm's most of the time, and the d17 have a relatively long stroke, so expect the gains over 4500-5000rpm.

And, you want a 9000rpm's motor without thinking about the oil pump...

Transmission- stage 1-3 clutch kit? Read the manufacturers specs. There specify for how many hp and tq the clutch is. If your engine doesn't make 300hp (something I know it wouldn't) don't use a stage 3 "bronce" clutch, just more money and damage to the engine.

use a stage 2 and a phantom grip...

-Conclusion-
A d17 with a race header, higher compression (PMS), no oil pump tuning, and 9000rpm's... is equal to a drag racing car just for one or half competition.

P.S.
I think you just read a lot of threads and copy...

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Old 08-14-2006, 04:37 PM   #20 (permalink)
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About the rod/stroke ratio.

d17 137/94.4= 1.45
d16 137/90= 1.52
b16b 142.3/77.4= 1.84
k20 139/86= 1.62

formula one and motorcycles more than 2.00 rod/stroke ratio. That's what those engines revs up to 13,000rpm's.

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