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-   -   Improving economy with VTEC-E (http://www.d-series.org/forums/engine-management/135806-improving-economy-vtec-e.html)

mini998 09-03-2010 06:51 AM

Improving economy with VTEC-E
 
Hi all ,

Hello to all ,this is my first visit here ,

I've been reading this forum for some time to get some info on vetc-e engine . :D

It seems like lot of people hate this type of engine due to restrictions of power ,But I'm after economy.plus I want to experience with ECU tuning , not to increase power or get more economy ,just for the experience .

I got two options

1. Buy a car with D15Z6 engine +P07 head (VTEC-E) , Would I be able to fit P28 in it? or do I have to modify the wiring for vtec solonoids?

2. Buy a normal VTEC (posibly D15Z8 +P1J head) try to fiddle with maps to get the maximum economy .

Which option is better for me ,I do not want to compromise any ECU tuning experience just for the sake of few pounds .But since I am not after any more power can I get the full ECU chip tuning experience with a VTEC-E engine?

PS :I would like to keep the engine as stock as possible

Thanks in advance

Cheers

awebb 09-03-2010 06:57 AM

I'll be honest I have no idea how to answer any of the questions you have but for better fuel economy:

-Decrease weight
-Decrease Coefficient of drag
-Make sure tire pressure is up
-Don't accelerate hard

kelvinzxcv 09-03-2010 07:09 AM

Fuel Economy, Hypermiling, EcoModding News and Forum - EcoModder.com

mini998 09-03-2010 07:43 AM

Thanks awebb ,kelvinzxcv

I guess I was bit complicated with my question

Would I be able to chip tune a Vtec-E without any modifications to the engine?

I am not after any more economy or power , just for the experience?

cheers

jrctr5 09-03-2010 09:41 AM

saving gas is all how you drive you could have the strongest engine but if you take it easy and shift at low rpms you will save alot of gas...

Dmod 09-03-2010 10:05 AM

I don't know if you would be able to chip and run a vtec-e without a bit of modification... If i were in your shoes.. i would get something that can run on a p28 ecu (idk where you live, doesn't sound like America, so i'm withholding specific engines and all being that im not as familiar with foreign engines)
As for tuning this thread and forum are good but pgmfi.org • Index page is a Super resource on learning to tune and play around with your ecu... what engine management system are you thinking about running?

cervan 09-03-2010 10:19 AM

you can tune any motor with a chipped ecu. Set vtec to whenever you want it to engage and adjust the timing maps to see fit. I will say though that i have not seen a p08 map on crome, hondata or ectune so you may be breaking new ground and have to make your own map wich is very time consuming. considering you have to get the AFR's right and the timing correct.

Dgold31 09-03-2010 10:21 AM

1 Attachment(s)
hahah V-tec E

12ozwrecker 09-03-2010 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dgold31 (Post 2101493)
hahah V-tec E

haha. red dot.

cmgreen50 09-03-2010 10:59 AM

^nice contribution noobass.




op if you wanna tune you could def start with an easier platorm

74civic4x4 09-03-2010 11:31 AM

The d15z1 is a pretty amazing little engine. Only puts out 91hp but is rated at 50mpg in a 49 state Civic VX. Other 50mpg cars, other than hybrids have barely more than half the hp. I'm running a d15z1 with a turbo in an AWD chassis. Mine is not running all that great right now but it is my fault, not the engine. Most guys on this forum are more interested in power than economy, but they do know there d-series sh%t. They just can't understand why you'd choose economy over power. ecommoder.com has some info on the vx but is is not Honda specific.

mini998 09-03-2010 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrctr5 (Post 2101456)
saving gas is all how you drive you could have the strongest engine but if you take it easy and shift at low rpms you will save alot of gas...

thanks mate ,
I'm not desperate to save fuel via tuning ,I hoping to do chip tuning just get the experience ,

And since this is going to be my daily runner and I'm doing lot of mileage it is good to have vtec-e .

mini998 09-03-2010 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dmod (Post 2101471)
I don't know if you would be able to chip and run a vtec-e without a bit of modification... If i were in your shoes.. i would get something that can run on a p28 ecu (idk where you live, doesn't sound like America, so i'm withholding specific engines and all being that im not as familiar with foreign engines)
As for tuning this thread and forum are good but pgmfi.org • Index page is a Super resource on learning to tune and play around with your ecu... what engine management system are you thinking about running?


I live in UK mate ,

All I'm concerned is whether the wiring for vtec solenoids is different in vtec-e vs vtec ?

with vtec-e ,will the 12 valve system (below 2800 RPM) going to be a problem with tuning? (if the 12v system entirely mechanical the I cant see any problem)

He are blessed with chippable Ecu's until 2000(ish) in UK ,So I might be able to use the same ECU.

I've been researching the PGMFI.ORG and PGMFI forum for some time ,and I am hoping to use CROME since there is lot of help available over there.

mini998 09-03-2010 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cervan (Post 2101491)
you can tune any motor with a chipped ecu. Set vtec to whenever you want it to engage and adjust the timing maps to see fit. I will say though that i have not seen a p08 map on crome, hondata or ectune so you may be breaking new ground and have to make your own map wich is very time consuming. considering you have to get the AFR's right and the timing correct.

Why can't I use P07 map with this mate? (since P07 is vtec-e , 1.5) ,am I missing something here?

mini998 09-03-2010 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 74civic4x4 (Post 2101534)
The d15z1 is a pretty amazing little engine. Only puts out 91hp but is rated at 50mpg in a 49 state Civic VX. Other 50mpg cars, other than hybrids have barely more than half the hp. I'm running a d15z1 with a turbo in an AWD chassis. Mine is not running all that great right now but it is my fault, not the engine. Most guys on this forum are more interested in power than economy, but they do know there d-series sh%t. They just can't understand why you'd choose economy over power. ecommoder.com has some info on the vx but is is not Honda specific.

I don't know whether we have d15zi here ,but we have D15Z3 ,D15Z6 ,D15Z8 which all are vtec-e ,and they are quoted at 114hp .

This is going to be my daily runner mate , Plus I do lot of mileage .I'm kind of broke these days so I want to use my daily runner as the test bench . So I can use the experience later on with a powerful motor

bigluelok 09-03-2010 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12ozwrecker (Post 2101521)
haha. red dot.

mission accomplished

12ozwrecker 09-03-2010 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigluelok (Post 2101606)
mission accomplished

bwahahaha!

eekazum 09-07-2010 10:25 AM

for starters, like you mentioned, vtec-e is designed specifically for fuel economy in mind and vtec is designed for power. it's arguable whether you could make a vtec and vtec-e perform like each other by modding or tuning or swapping ecus or adding turbos and adjusting driving styles but since your project is more economy oriented, i suggest starting with an vtec-e motor.

i know there's a d13 engine out there that's known deliver some crazy mpgs but if you live in los angeles, i'd avoid any freeways or major streets. i also hear you can slap on a tiny turbo and drive like there's an egg between your foot and the gas pedal to get results.

personally, i opted for the 3 stage vtec that combined the vtec and vtec-e but it proved to be a bit of work trying to get the proper ecu alone. customy8 here has plenty of info on this engine.

if you're looking for experience in tuning, i'm sure the differences in power and economy will become obvious once you dive into the nitty gritty.

christopher_davis 09-07-2010 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mini998 (Post 2101371)
Thanks awebb ,kelvinzxcv

I guess I was bit complicated with my question

Would I be able to chip tune a Vtec-E without any modifications to the engine?

I am not after any more economy or power , just for the experience?

cheers

yes you can chip it but there are a few things to consider.

The easiest way to do it is p28 and convert to a 4-wire primary o2,and forget about the EGR that the vtec-e's have(for the sake of being simple). also get a vacuum gauge and watch it closely when driving.

take those few things into account and get the ball rolling, an adjustable cam gear wouldn't hurt either but I wouldn't worry about than now and if your just going for MPG's a or LPK a street tune would probably suffice

christopher_davis 09-07-2010 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eekazum (Post 2104592)

personally, i opted for the 3 stage vtec that combined the vtec and vtec-e but it proved to be a bit of work trying to get the proper ecu alone. customy8 here has plenty of info on this engine.


I like the 3-stage vtec in theory it's very cool, but with the cam phasing most modern engines have it's hard to want to go old skool and complicate things.

IMO and from what i've observed (from others and myself) high MPG's can be had from most any d-series head, provided the right combination of things. If I were in the market again for a d head that was some form of 12 to 16 valve whether it be y5/b5 3-stage head etc i'd go for the y5 because it's simplicity and the 3-stagers have some much damn valve train weight.


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