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Old 05-25-2007, 10:48 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default bad rear main seal or bad oil pan gasket?

I put my car on the lift today to get an o2 bung welded in and oil was actually dripping out from somewhere at a pretty good rate of flow. It wasnt pouring out, but a real real fast drip......

I just had my motor built 2500 miles ago and all gaskets and seals were replaced. when i installed my turbo, i eliminated the pcv system totally.

It is leaking where the inspection plate is.....you know, the cover next to the oil pan that bolts to the bottom of the tranny. We started the car, revved it up a little and it started drippind at a pretty good rate......would that be a main seal or bad oil pan gasket?

if it is a main seal, what will need to be done in order to replace it? i.e....pulling motor or tranny?

And could the turbo have caused this? reason i ask is because the persone whi built my motor said that if something happens that the turbo could cause, he wont fix it under warranty.....i think personaly that he messed up installing the main seal, because they just dont go bad after 2500 miles...

thanks for any help.
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Old 05-25-2007, 11:06 AM   #2 (permalink)
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I'm guessing that it's because you got rid of the PCV system. Even without a turbo the crankcase will build up pressure and need ventilation. With a turbo you'll get more blowby and more pressure in the case. With a pressurized case the oil will leak out of the path of least resistance, which could either be the RMS or the oil pan gasket. I think if you add a ventilation system your leak will go away or at least be less than it is now.
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Old 05-25-2007, 11:31 AM   #3 (permalink)
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pull the inspection plate. if there is oil on the flywheel, congrats you need a RMS. if not oil pan gasket probubly got pinched when installing it.

^when i say on the flywheel, i mean all over. flung everywhere, at least thats what mine looked like.
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Old 05-25-2007, 11:41 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by 99EJ6T View Post
pull the inspection plate. if there is oil on the flywheel, congrats you need a RMS. if not oil pan gasket probubly got pinched when installing it.

^when i say on the flywheel, i mean all over. flung everywhere, at least thats what mine looked like.
2 questions......

1.) did you need to replace/resurface flywheel or just clean really well.

2.) What is the process of removing and reinstalling a RMS?

thanks for your help
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Old 05-25-2007, 11:49 AM   #5 (permalink)
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you could just clean the flywheel. as far as replacing the rms, you have to remove the trans, clutch and flywheel to get to it.
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Old 05-25-2007, 11:50 AM   #6 (permalink)
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edit: ^damn your fast typing

1) just clean it really well, to get all the oil residue off of it.

2)like this;
pull trans
pull clutch assembly
pull flywheel
pull seal
install new seal
install flywheel
inspect clutch plate, to ensure oil did not soak into the clutch plate*
install clutch assembly
install trans

* if there is oil soaked into the clutch, it will need to be replaced. just the disk though. pp will just need to be cleaned.
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Old 05-25-2007, 12:01 PM   #7 (permalink)
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i had a similar problem in my b7. turned out being the oil pan gasket. what happened was we used a silicone gasket maker on a silicone based gasket.

way too slippery...
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Old 05-25-2007, 01:11 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Gearz View Post
I'm guessing that it's because you got rid of the PCV system. Even without a turbo the crankcase will build up pressure and need ventilation. With a turbo you'll get more blowby and more pressure in the case. With a pressurized case the oil will leak out of the path of least resistance, which could either be the RMS or the oil pan gasket. I think if you add a ventilation system your leak will go away or at least be less than it is now.

I second your opinion.
Crankcase pressure sounds to be the cause to me to.
I'd guess the rear main.
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Old 05-25-2007, 01:47 PM   #9 (permalink)
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i think its 3.2 hours flat rate just to give you an idea...
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Old 05-25-2007, 04:49 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I second your opinion.
Crankcase pressure sounds to be the cause to me to.
I'd guess the rear main.
what are you guys talking about......why do you think i got rid of the pcv system?.......to relieve pressure!!! I have an open dump on the black box and it relieves all pressures that are in the crank case...........

I have a felpro oil pan gasket and i actually did use some gray silicon gasket maker on it.....but its been this way for about 800 miles, so why would it take so long to do this?

How will i know if it was my oil pan gasket just by looking?

thanks
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Old 05-25-2007, 08:35 PM   #11 (permalink)
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1) I have a felpro oil pan gasket...

2) How will i know if it was my oil pan gasket just by looking?
1) ok, you should have used OEM

2) it will be seeping from more then one area. in my experiance oil pan gaskets don't beed, they seep. due to the lack of pressure on the gasket itself. however, o-ring style gaskets tend to be used on areas that have pressure against the ring. and when they pop, they bleed. think of it this way as the oil soaks though the gasket, it causes more of the gasket to seep. making the area effected bigger as time goes on. if it is the gasket it will start in one sport and slowly continue to erode the rest of the gasket sealing ability.

try this, clean the area with brake cleaner. make sure you hit every place the oil landed/came out of. then start the car, let it run up to normal operating. run the car about ten mins longer after it comes to temp, shut the car off. now look for the leak, while it is still hot. you should be able to find the leak right after you slide under the car. it will more then likely drip on you, so wear goggles.

look in the normal areas. near the oil pump, rear main, and toward the back under the oil filter. you would be surprised where oil can end up looking like it came from, when it comes out of the filter.
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Old 05-26-2007, 07:45 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I think is the oil seal. when I was putting oil seal on I notice that it was bending in one area of the seal more that the rest, when I took it out to check, The oil seal been brand new with the oil pump, had a rip acroos. If I would have install it like that I would have a major leak. And when I was installing the rear seal when I was tighting the bolt the seal kind of move and it wasn't sit properly. I took it out reinstall it and problem solve. I use Honda Bond, works great. Make sure that the inside lip of the seal and the crak itself is nice lubricated that way the crank would spin, not the seal itself.
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Old 05-26-2007, 08:40 PM   #13 (permalink)
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could be the oil pan gasket, RMS, or the side block cap (since the Motor was rebuilt it might have been taken off). Oil pan gasket is an easy fix, just drop the pan, clean the seal and reseal with the gray silicone gasket sealer, or replace the seal and seal it up and reinstall. RMS and Side block cap require the same thing, i.e. removing the tranny and clutch assembly to inspect. Replace the RMS if its leaking. I have had my RMS slip seat on me and started to leak and i didnt realize it til it was too late and i had to buy a new clutch disk. And the block cap requires you to drop the oil pan as well as everything else, remove it, clean it, reseal with gray silicone or hondabond and reinstall everything. From my experience, it could be a toss up between all three due to the motor rebuild recently. Good luck, hope you get it fixed soon.
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Old 05-26-2007, 09:37 PM   #14 (permalink)
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thanks everyone.........if this info helps: When i first got my motor rebuilt, i drove it for 1000 miles for a break-in period. It did no leaking of the sort, but i removed the oil pan to tap it, and replaced it.......i didnt have a torque wrench so i just gave them a good tightening......i wasnt really thinking at the time, but i guess i could have possibly overtightened the pan and gasket...........now it leaks after turbo install.

maybe that will help
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Old 05-26-2007, 10:00 PM   #15 (permalink)
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so was it the old gasket or new one? also how was the pan tapped?... i.e. is the bung welded in/just treaded on/teflon taped and treaded on...
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Old 05-27-2007, 07:19 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Then chances are the leak is from the oil pan gasket. Is ok if you don't have a torque wrench, but you have to be carefull when tiding the bolts. you have to do it in the order it suppose to be and ALWAYS keep an eye on the gasket because if you don't it might move in certain areas and and a leak is garanteed!! Once again Honda bond, but just a tiny tiny bit all the way around this whould help keeping the gasket on place making it a lot easier when you putting the oil pan back. Once again remember just a tiny bit, you don't want to put a lot because when you are doing your torque down, particules can fall on your engine oil and you know what can happen.
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Old 05-27-2007, 09:16 AM   #17 (permalink)
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so was it the old gasket or new one? also how was the pan tapped?... i.e. is the bung welded in/just treaded on/teflon taped and treaded on...
It had about 1000 miles on it so i reused the gasket from the rebuild. A threaded pipe bung was welded to the pan, the return fitting was tefloned, and threaded onto it.....

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Then chances are the leak is from the oil pan gasket. Is ok if you don't have a torque wrench, but you have to be carefull when tiding the bolts. you have to do it in the order it suppose to be and ALWAYS keep an eye on the gasket because if you don't it might move in certain areas and and a leak is garanteed!! Once again Honda bond, but just a tiny tiny bit all the way around this whould help keeping the gasket on place making it a lot easier when you putting the oil pan back. Once again remember just a tiny bit, you don't want to put a lot because when you are doing your torque down, particules can fall on your engine oil and you know what can happen.
What order is it supposed to be torqued? The leak is coming from behind the inspection plate....leaking out through the bottom......does that still make you think oil pan gasket?
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Old 05-27-2007, 08:17 PM   #18 (permalink)
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bump.......i need to keep driving the car until at least this weekend........if it is the rear main seal, it turns out to be ok that i have to fix it. Heres why......when my motor and tranny were built (had lsd installed in tranny), the tranny didnt seal properly so it developed a slow leak. The person who did the rebuild said that he would pull the tranny, pull it apart, and reseal it to fix the leak......all of this would be done for free. he said while hes in there the rear main seal would be an easy fix for no extra charge. So it is all getting fixed for the price of the main seal itself.

But my main worry is ruining my clutch while driving on it through the week. I drive about 120 miles on the interstate every other day.........what are the chances of ruining my clutch disc?

thanks
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Old 05-27-2007, 10:58 PM   #19 (permalink)
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what are the chances of ruining my clutch disc?
probable with that amount of driving depending on the leak severity. Slow leak, brake parts cleaner will suffice and itll be fine. Medium to fast leak will most likely result in hot spotting the pp and flywheel and soak the disk in oil. sorry to be the barer of bad news bro, but you shouldnt drive it til its fixed.
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Old 05-28-2007, 04:21 AM   #20 (permalink)
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if the leak is not that bad, go ahead, but if is something mayor, then rent a car or something.
Im glad the are willing to fix the problem, and yes change the rear seal and get a new oil pan gasket too while you at it, and be carefull when installing it. Make sure the inside of the seal is lubricated and put some honda bond on the outside lip, just a little bit. Also use it on the oil pan.
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