d17 stroker

[1991rex]

Hi am considering getting a d16 block and installing a d17 crankshaft...has anyone done this? can pm9 pistons be used if so? no intention at all to go forced induction so staying n/a ... heard somewhere rod angle could be an issue? like to hear from someone who has actually done this...successfully i hope...thanks

[transzex]

yep, been done......not sure of the pistons used.......

[1991rex]

anyone know of any writeup? seriously considering this just want to know what involved...pros cons etc thanks

[transzex]

yep, search on here.....there is info.....

[sql_civic]

I haven't done this but basically you need to use the crank and rods from the a D17. The crank is what obviously gives you the extra stroke but you need to use the rods because they are thin enough to fit on the narrower journals on the crank. Crower does make an aftermarket rod for the D17 that you could use. Another issue is that the snout of the crank has a wider diameter so you need to have that ground down to fit a D16 crank pulley and timing gear. Now I'm not 100% sure about this but you might need the D17 oil pump since it's also sized for the crank. Another problem here is that there is no hole in the pump for the dip stick for some D16s. I believe the D16Z6 block might be a good choice for this build since the dip stick is located elsewhere. The D17 oil pan and pickup might be optional but I often see them included in the mods for a setup like this.

[Dibble]

I THINK you can use a d16y8 block and not have to mod the oil pump. Im not sure.

[1991rex]

can d16 pm9 pistons be used in this combo? not sure but heard the crank rod angle is bad on this combo...want to boost displacement and other than boring i think this is my only cost effective approach... i assume an a6 block not a good opinion either? was thinking about getting the z6 block and building that....didn't know that about the dipstick... any machine can cut down the crank snout? just want to know what i amgetting into before starting this thanks

[sql_civic]

Yes you will have to notch the block to provide clearance for the the rod.

My guess is no, you cannot use the pm9 pistons. The wrist pin size of the D17 rod different (I can't remember if it's smaller or larger). So you need a piston that fits the D17 rods. Of course the D17 pistons fit the D17 rods and the D16 75mm bore.

[transzex]

*cough*GX*cough*

[slebidia]

How I did it.

Here's my parts list:

D16A6 block
D17A1 crank
D17A1 pistons and rods
D17A1 oil pump
B16A crank pulley

I think I used an A6 pan with a modifed pan gasket to fit the oil pump. I also had to remove a pan stud or two from the pump to fit the pan.

The D16A6 block needed to be notched so the rods would clear.

Pistons sat .045 below the deck if I remember correctly. It was a lot lower than I thought it should be.

[1991rex]

if i used a z6 block i wouldn't have to notch the block? is there any affordable hi compression pistons available for the d17? thanks for replies thus far already learned more then what i found by searching (couldn't find much this seems to be an uncommon mod)

[1991rex]

How I did it.

Here's my parts list:

D16A6 block
D17A1 crank
D17A1 pistons and rods
D17A1 oil pump
B16A crank pulley

I think I used an A6 pan with a modifed pan gasket to fit the oil pump. I also had to remove a pan stud or two from the pump to fit the pan.

The D16A6 block needed to be notched so the rods would clear.

Pistons sat .045 below the deck if I remember correctly. It was a lot lower than I thought it should be.

noticeable improvement in power?

[slebidia]

Over what?

[sql_civic]

^^ Hey, 1000 posts. WOOT!!

I have some good links in H-T from a guy that did the mod and discusses tuning and other results. I'll post when I get home.

[1991rex]

Over what?

over a regular d16

[1991rex]

^^ Hey, 1000 posts. WOOT!!

I have some good links in H-T from a guy that did the mod and discusses tuning and other results. I'll post when I get home.

thanks that would be great.. may have to run out to wallyworld and get new ink cartridges for the printer! lol would like to print off some info on this

[slebidia]

over a regular d16

I haven't driven a regular D16 in over 6 years.

I like my ZCs better than the D17 frankenstien.

[1991rex]

bump for more info

[sql_civic]

There's a lot of great info on this link on pistons and rods.

http://heeltoeauto.com/httech/YaBB.pl?num=1160787887

Note the discussion on rods towards the end.

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1352993

Look for posts on H-T by Jim Truett. Here's the gist of what Jim did...

"Quote, originally posted by d16dcoe45 »

Hey man--are you using a d17 crank (94.4) in your d16z6 like it says in your sig? I hear it requires a bit a machining to fit, how did it work out?

Yep, D17A2 crank/rods/pistons. To put it in an A6 or Z6 block you need to notch the block for the rod swing. I used ARP rod bolts so the main girdle needed to be notched for clearance. The D17 oil pump bolts right on, and a modified Y8 main seal flange is on the rear. I used a modified Y8 aluminum oil pan. The crank pulley also needed to be opened up to 28mm to slip over the crank snout.

The low end torque is really impressive, even with my 12# flywheel. It was well worth it since it is my daily driver, and the torque has made it much more fun (coming from a boosted D15B).

I'm using a Y8 block, Crower maxi-light rods and custom Arias pistons to get to ~11.5:1 with a Y7 head. Yes, staying non-VTEC!"

[1991rex]

thanks for the great info...learning more about the d everyday!

[SupaStyl]

seems like alot of hassle for a worse bore to stroke ratio than the 1.6....

[Jim Truett]

seems like alot of hassle for a worse bore to stroke ratio than the 1.6....

Yeah, it was a lot of work and $, but at 10psi from the biggest T3 I could get my hands on, the torque on the street is impressive. I don't need to push it past 7100 rpm anyway.

[strykersd]

Anyone have any dyno numbers on a D17/D16 combo? Either NA or FI, just curious how much more power you can squeeze out of this setup. Oh and hey Jim I didn't know you were a member here, I'm the guy who sold you those transmissions the other day.

[1991rex]

been im'ing jim he is making 260 whp with his setup with no reliability issues at all

[sql_civic]

Jim, what are you using for tuning/fuel/timing management?

[Jim Truett]

Jim, what are you using for tuning/fuel/timing management?

Neptune RTP.

[Jim Truett]

Anyone have any dyno numbers on a D17/D16 combo? Either NA or FI, just curious how much more power you can squeeze out of this setup. Oh and hey Jim I didn't know you were a member here, I'm the guy who sold you those transmissions the other day.

I've been a member here for a while, but don't post much. Thank you for all of the extra parts. It's been a while since I have seen carnage like that in a tranny. The EX was abused pretty good. It needs two shift forks, all new ball bearings and a 3/4 synchro sleeve.

The last NA D17/Z6 I saw results on was something like 141hp/118tq on a dynojet. I don't have the chart anymore.

[kookk]

I've been a member here for a while, but don't post much. Thank you for all of the extra parts. It's been a while since I have seen carnage like that in a tranny. The EX was abused pretty good. It needs two shift forks, all new ball bearings and a 3/4 synchro sleeve.

The last NA D17/Z6 I saw results on was something like 141hp/118tq on a dynojet. I don't have the chart anymore.

What kind of cylinder head built was on this D17/Z6? Any cams, headwork, etc...?

[Jim Truett]

What kind of cylinder head built was on this D17/Z6? Any cams, headwork, etc...?

Stock cam, ported head, milled .020", S2 Pro intake manifold, 60mm TB.

[kookk]

I love this thread!!!!!

What oversized pistons and forged rods are there available for the D17 crank.

I am only aware of the Crower rods which are really expensive.

There also seems to be a D17A1 and D17A2 block. Any diff in them?

[sql_civic]

I've got some notes of a guy using Mitsh. Gallant v6 oversized 50 piston (78.9mm). I haven't confirmed the compatibility with crower or stock rods, compression height, etc.

I've got another note that someone used custom Arias pistons. No other details though.

I'm looking into Miata pistons. I thought there might be something there but I haven't gotten far with my research.

Not sure why you care about the A1 or A2 D17 block. The block is not really part of this build. The pistons are different though. The A2 block has the VTEC head,

[1991rex]

bump for more info...was thinking of getting custom crower rods if i do this ( if mine sits 0.045 down) anyone know of best place to purchase crower rods?

[stmotorsports]

I dunno that I would get longer rods, I would either go with custom pistons or shaved down normal D15/16 slugs. I still believe that the jdm d15b versions will work as they have similar dish as the D17 pistons I have, much more generous valve reliefs, and slightly higher comp height than the D17s so they should really be almost ideal when combined with a mild mill on the head and 2-layer y8 hg. Unfortunately I have just never gotten the time to actually do a physical mock up, but I can't see why you would have any probs getting it to around 10.5:1 depending on milling, etc.

If you will be leaving the crank snout OD as is and running the D17 oil pump, you can also use the alum D17 pan- it bolts right up to the z6 block and clears the stock girdle. Otherwise as mentioned before you should be able to have the snout turned down to normal D15/16 size and run all standard d parts- pump/pan/timing covers/pulleys/etc.

[kookk]

I've got some notes of a guy using Mitsh. Gallant v6 oversized 50 piston (78.9mm). I haven't confirmed the compatibility with crower or stock rods, compression height, etc.

I've got another note that someone used custom Arias pistons. No other details though.

I'm looking into Miata pistons. I thought there might be something there but I haven't gotten far with my research.

Not sure why you care about the A1 or A2 D17 block. The block is not really part of this build. The pistons are different though. The A2 block has the VTEC head,

Just making sure. So the crank from both blocks will do for such a build.

The pistons are diff? Both 75mm and which will give a higher comp if using a D17 crank, rod and pistons?

[HONDA300]

does anyone have any pics of the block being notched.

[sql_civic]

Just making sure. So the crank from both blocks will do for such a build.

The pistons are diff? Both 75mm and which will give a higher comp if using a D17 crank, rod and pistons?

Yes the crank from the A1 and A2 are the same. Part Number 13310-PLM-A00.

Pistons:

PLM-A00
01-03 DX
D17A1
total height: 46.50mm
compression height: 27.00mm
2.62mm dish

PLR-A00
01-03 EX/HX
D17A2
total height: 46.50mm
compression height: 27.00mm
2.66mm dish

Looks to me like you'd get slightly higher compression from the A1. The GX pistons are domed so that might be another consideration.

Also, the diameter of the crank snout needs to be reduced if you want it to fit a Y8 pulley.

How to notch a block with pics.

http://www.theoldone.com/articles/d_series_engine_building_tips/