help me spend $3000.

[john]

well heres the story...

i was thinking of swapping a b16 into a del sol si. it comes with the d16z6 as you all know. instead of spending my three grand doing that an only walking away with 170 crank horsepower... i want to go turbo d.

the facts are this:
its going into a del sol si.
the d16z6 will most likely have 100k plus miles on it already.
it will be my daily driver.
its gotta be reliable.
im shooting for at least 200whp.
i want to go with a johnnyracecar intercooler.

with 3000 to spend, i need to cover everything. this means intercooler, fuel management, turbo parts, whatever.

what do you guys reccomend i do. i know alot about engines and whatnot on paper, but i've never actually torn one apart. i am more than willing to do so, and learn- i will have a car for down time, but the less downtime the better.

i have never done this- so im not sure on prices. based on what i've been told, i figure i can afford home made turbo kit, fuel management, and some internal parts, but im not sure what ones.

thanks to anyone who read through all of that, and thanks even more if you are going to help me out. :)

dseries forever!

[Stealthmode]

I think you should go to www.homemadeturbo.com and check out some of the things that have been done for way less than $3000. You can have a very reliable turbo kit pushing 8 psi or so for just over $1000 if you do your homework and find out where you need to go/all your options. Check out some intercoolers made by Custom Coach of America also. They are similar to the johnny racecar ones, except they have top and bottom plates which is better for durability. You can look them up at www.speedpartsrus.com
Long story short= homemade kit/save the rest.

[john]

I think you should go to www.homemadeturbo.com and check out some of the things that have been done for way less than $3000. You can have a very reliable turbo kit pushing 8 psi or so for just over $1000 if you do your homework and find out where you need to go/all your options. Check out some intercoolers made by Custom Coach of America also. They are similar to the johnny racecar ones, except they have top and bottom plates which is better for durability. You can look them up at www.speedpartsrus.com
Long story short= homemade kit/save the rest.

why save the money? i can do the hommade kit and then have something like 1600 to work the bottom end, thus allowing me to increase boost. thing is, im not sure what internals to get to make it very reliable...

[ghettoturbo]

what internals to get?..you said you were looking for around 200, you should just stick with stock stuff. je pistons and eagle rods can be had for cheap though

[Rexinre]

I think he said at least 200 so maybe he wants more then 210 or 250. What are you looking to get out of this as an end result John?

[john]

end result... a fast daily driver than is reliable.

plus, i know you guys reccomend hondata, but i like the look of the vafcs, PLUS its nice to be able to see all that info. (the vafc2 has a knock sensor)

[beerbongskickass]

i know you guys reccomend hondata, but i like the look of the vafcs, PLUS its nice to be able to see all that info. (the vafc2 has a knock sensor)
WTF? lol... :lol:

[oscarmayer]

well if you just get rods and pistons, replace the bets and hoses. your already into about $1200 there. that pleaves $1800. you could get a used Greddy kit with fmic and bov for that proce and product 250 wheel power and 15 lbs of boost. I'm sure there are other used kits that will laos do the job and it will be far less headaches and faster end results as well as very relyable.

[Rexinre]

Saw that comming with the greddy kit sell ^^^

[john]

doesn't the greddy have shitty tuning or whatever?

[Rexinre]

I dono, some people have said that but that is what you get with any piggy back system. If you want it done quickly (oscar is right) a bolt on kit will do what you are looking for. Anything over 220 whp you should replace your pistons and rods. You can get a bolt on kit and stay around 200 until you get enough money saved to replace the bottom end. Just a thought! Also there are some drag kits out there to let you go bigger in the future!

Good Luck

[john]

so.. start with rods and low compression pistons, and use the rest of the money to build a kit that will go for 250hp?

[Rexinre]

Yeah, that will work too!

[john]

how reliable would that be then? this is my daily driver.. i dont want valves to eat shit after a month.

[Rexinre]

I wouldn't lower my compression if it’s a daily driver. Pistons and rods should allow you to run up to 14lbs of boost safely. O and some tuning on the dyno too.

[john]

so stay with stock compression, get new pistons, new rods, new gaskets here and there, piece together a turbo kit, some simple fuel management, and hondata... then run 14psi?

[Rexinre]

hondata will do fuel management if you choose to go that route. Read homemadeturbo.com for additional things needed. IE fuel pump, injectors, colder spark plugs...............

[john]

hondata will do fuel management if you choose to go that route. Read homemadeturbo.com for additional things needed. IE fuel pump, injectors, colder spark plugs...............

ok.
what do you mean by "if you choose to do that route"

[Rexinre]

Hondata is used with an ODB1 Computer which you have no problems with. If you go to www.hondata.com you will see all that you might use. I have never used hondata so I dono what exactly you will need, maybe someone else can help you out who has hondata...

[john]

what about uberdata?

[Rexinre]

That will work as well, go to the uberdata website and look at the FAQ page. http://www.ecimulti.org/uberdata

[john]

hrm. it says you have solder stuff to get uberdata to work.

f that.

i'll stick with hondata ;)

[john]

btw, where in nj are you from?

[Rexinre]

Vernon

[john]

ah. im in jackson (six flags)

[Rexinre]

Nice, do you go to Englishtown?

[john]

nah. i gotta get this car built first. ;)

[beerbongskickass]

hrm. it says you have solder stuff to get uberdata to work.

f that.

i'll stick with hondata ;)

What do you think you have to do with hondata? :roll:


Try searching and doing research before asking questions. Building the car is the last thing I would do. With $3,000 go with a custom turbo kit and use uberdata for fuel management, then get exhaust, clutch, suspension, and then worry about building the motor. You can make 200whp no problem on a stock motor.

[john]

i was saying at least 200whp.

damnit i dont want to solder my ecu.. how much is it to get done?

what im worried about is the high milage that will be on the engine.

[beerbongskickass]

i was saying at least 200whp.

damnit i dont want to solder my ecu.. how much is it to get done?

what im worried about is the high milage that will be on the engine.

I know what you were saying, but I am saying having a 300whp motor with stock exhaust, stock clutch, and stock suspension is pointless.

It will cost you like $25 in parts (including the chip) to socket your ECU. Then all you need is a chip burner $60-$120 and some DSM 450cc injectors w/resistor box $60. So your looking at roughly $150-$200 and you can have a stand alone fuel management system that works just as well as hondata. The big difference is that uberdata is free.

Don't worry about your mileage.

[john]

i was planning on this.

3000 sol
3000 engine
700 wheels
500 suspension
600 interior & exterior (wheel, shifter, painted lip, painted skirts etc)
600 seats

its a daily driver, so im worried about it looking somewhat decent.

[Bigwig NJ]

give me the $3000 and ill custom build you a turbo system and install it for ya. Ill also gaurentee at least a 70% increase over your stock whp number.

btw im kidding....well partially

Get a turbo setup for about $1000. spend $250+/- on an exhaust. spend $300 on a clutch. drive around and see what you want/dont want.

if necessary i will make a complete list of how to make a $1000 turbo setup.....

[john]

sounds good to me.

[Bigwig NJ]

T3 .42/.48 or T3 .60/.48
Simple Log Manifold. Find somewhere or someone to make one. should cost about $200.
DP~$100. meinkie
FMIC from www.johnnyracecar.com Get the 5" b/c its a good price and is good for like 275whp which i doubt you will ever see.
WG=Internal
Charge pipes- JC whitney. there is a section in the DIY section about doing a hmt and that site has a listing of what pipes you need. Get one extra 90 or 180. i used that diagram this weekend to cut my pipes and i found that i could have used an extra 90.

BOV: 1g DSM or anything off a stock turbod car. even the plastic ones work up to about 15psi but i would try to get a metal one.

Injectors: 440-450cc injectors. DSM 450's can be had for $50.

Chip your ECU and get someone to burn a basemap for you: $50

I think that should cover just about everything.

Prices:
Turbo=$150
Charge pipes: $100
BOV= $50
DP= $100
Manifold= $200
FMIC= $190
ECU= $50-70
Injectors= $50-70
Misc= $50-100

add it up, you should be in that $1000 ball park. That setup will be good for like 250whp-300whp. your rods arent, but thats another topic.

[john]

awesome. can i incorporate a vafc into this, or some apexi unit?

[Bigwig NJ]

awesome. can i incorporate a vafc into this, or some apexi unit?

why would you want to? Uberdata>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>shit in your mouth>>>>>>>>>>>>>AFC>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Someone puking on you>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>emanage>fmu

[john]

what about some apexi boost controller.

[Bigwig NJ]

I hear a lot of good things about the Turbo XS MBC. supposidly it nearly eliminates all boost spikes/creep which is always a good thing on an internal gate. Another one that is good is the Dawes devices. they have a lot of knock off's on ebays that run around $25. do a search on google and look at the picture and try to find one on ebay for cheaper.

Personally i plan to be running a fancy dancy MBC setup. It will consist of uberdata controlling solenoids so my boost is dependent on gear/rpm. basically its the cheapest way to get traction.

[john]

i want that ;p

you gotta help me out.

jackson nj here.

[beerbongskickass]

I hear a lot of good things about the Turbo XS MBC. supposidly it nearly eliminates all boost spikes/creep which is always a good thing on an internal gate.

I have the standard TurboXS mbc and it works pretty well. Before I had the boost controller my shitty internal wastegate would creep at higher loads. With the boost controller hooked up it still creeps, but it has to be the shitty internal wastegates fault since it was doing it before I had the boost controller. I need to get an external wastegate, but mine will do for now.

[oscarmayer]

the biggest issues with uberdata. nO support.... your pretty much on your ownh except a little forums section. I'ld rather pay the extra $ to hondata (whcih is where uberdata stole their info and programming from in the first place) and be able to pick up the phone and talk to someone for help. the extra few $$ is just worth it to me. and that wau I know it's done right.

[beerbongskickass]

the biggest issues with uberdata. nO support.... your pretty much on your ownh except a little forums section. I'ld rather pay the extra $ to hondata (whcih is where uberdata stole their info and programming from in the first place) and be able to pick up the phone and talk to someone for help. the extra few $$ is just worth it to me. and that wau I know it's done right.

That's what got me to buy my hondata, the lack of support uberdata had. When I realized hondata and uberdata were the same thing I sold my hondata. Now that I know a little more about fuel management that "little forum" is more than enough support. There are lots of online forums and plenty of info to help you on the internet. The tech section on the hondata site has tons of useful info. If somebody knows how to tune/install hondata they can tune/install uberdata just as easy. Hondata is not worht the extra $1,000+ if you ask me.

[Bigwig NJ]

the biggest issues with uberdata. nO support.... your pretty much on your ownh except a little forums section. I'ld rather pay the extra $ to hondata (whcih is where uberdata stole their info and programming from in the first place) and be able to pick up the phone and talk to someone for help. the extra few $$ is just worth it to me. and that wau I know it's done right.

Uberdata didnt steal anything from hondata. Blake did all the leg work himself and figured out how to crack the ECU and all that jazz. If anything you can say Crome stole the info from Uberdata. Actually hondata had a fucked up formula which was causing a lot of problems with hessitation and some of the pgmfi guys brought it to their attention and how to solve it. Also some of those guys were invited to the hondata seminar a few weeks ago because they respect what they do. So seriously, fuck you.

[oscarmayer]

the biggest issues with uberdata. nO support.... your pretty much on your ownh except a little forums section. I'ld rather pay the extra $ to hondata (whcih is where uberdata stole their info and programming from in the first place) and be able to pick up the phone and talk to someone for help. the extra few $$ is just worth it to me. and that wau I know it's done right.

Uberdata didnt steal anything from hondata. Blake did all the leg work himself and figured out how to crack the ECU and all that jazz. If anything you can say Crome stole the info from Uberdata. Actually hondata had a fucked up formula which was causing a lot of problems with hessitation and some of the pgmfi guys brought it to their attention and how to solve it. Also some of those guys were invited to the hondata seminar a few weeks ago because they respect what they do. So seriously, fuck you.

while you "could be correct, that last line was NOT needed, if you cna;t post w/o being an ass, don't post. The only tie you find me comming off strogn is when I've been attacked first. like here. If you can;t respect, why shoudl I respect you?

Fix your post..... I'm sure the admins might not liek your f words posted and may even ban for it.

[S Q A D]

what is this grade school ?? we are all adults .. I think if someone wants to type out " curse words " then so be it .. this is fucking america not russia ...

[Bigwig NJ]

if someone bans me for saying you are a fucking moron, that would be quite silly.

I doubt they would ban me for calling you a fucking asshat, seeing you are one. Im pretty sure the moderators would prefer having someone with some knowledge rather than having a member like you that just repeats things and says things without knowing what the fuck they are talking about. Seriously, I would start questioning legit your info is before you post it, because most of your posts are 100% wrong

[MadCow]

nO support.... your pretty much on your ownh except a little forums section.
Right, a little forum must be a bad thing... especially considering that it's browsed and used DAILY by the very person that wrote the software AND the very people that wrote all of the scripts for the additional features...

I'ld rather pay the extra $ to hondata and be able to pick up the phone and talk to someone for help. the extra few $$ is just worth it to me. and that wau I know it's done right.
Little? Are you kidding me? $495 for S200 w/boost. Last time I checked, at least in my book, $495 is enough to buy a whole d-series swap. $495 isn't little.

(whcih is where uberdata stole their info and programming from in the first place)
Honestly, what the fuck are you talking about? überdata stole NOTHING from Hondata. Visit pgmfi.org and browse the forums. Take a good look at the information there. überdata was made possible buy a TON of people there who all put time into figuring things out about the processes and workings of the P72 ecu code. Honestly, this single comment made me register for this board. I simply cannot begin to explain to you how wrong you are, and how unfounded that statement is. If anyone deserves to be banned, it's you.

Got questions? My AIM SN is in my profile.

[TurboEF9]

(whcih is where uberdata stole their info and programming from in the first place)


You've lost that last bit of creditbility I was willing to give you. Uberdata, TurboEDIT, CROME... all written 100% from the ground up by *A LOT* of hard working people. From disassembling of the the ROMs, and countless man hours pouring over STOCK, yes STOCK Honda ECU code to add features like Launch Control, Datalogging, Real-Time Programming, WideBand O2 support, in addition to even the most taken for granted features like Map editing, Rev Limits, VTEC, so on and so forth, came knowledge, and experience.

Do NOT question, Blake's (Uberdata) and his countless contributors, My (TurboEDIT), PGMFI (A spectacular group of guys that bring ECU Hacking to the masses), or anyone else associated with the development our engine management applications' integrity.

We've all worked long and hard for the experience and knowledge that we've gained over the years, and if you don't respect that, then you'll have a miserable life on ANY of the worthwhile forums around the world. I promise you that. :evil:

[S Q A D]

dude oscarmayer.. ur just pissin everyone off ..

[96hatchman]

hahaha, i just read this whole thread and its crackin me up