Need some advice

[k3rnel]

Hey guys,
Im new to the forum and I am looking for someones advice/opinion. I am buying a 2005 Civic. Right now, I have the 2005 Civic VP with a D17A1 engine. I am also looking at the HX model which adds a ton of more features, and I also noticed that it comes standard with a VTEC engine, is the engine different in the HX model versus the VP? Im not planning on doing anything beyond adding a CAI and an MSD ignition to the engine, then maybe a body kit on the exterior and carbon fiber hood. The one thing I do not like about the VP package is that there is no tach in the instrument cluster, but I was thinking I could install an aftermarket one on the dash anyhow. Also, there are no power windows/door locks, can I get these installed with aftermarket parts? Im just looking to save a little money up front, this is my first Civic and I want to make the right decision.

[custom_junky]

Hey guys,
Im new to the forum and I am looking for someones advice/opinion. I am buying a 2005 Civic. Right now, I have the 2005 Civic VP with a D17A1 engine. I am also looking at the HX model which adds a ton of more features, and I also noticed that it comes standard with a VTEC engine, is the engine different in the HX model versus the VP?

The difference is the VTEC only, honda uses the head to make the difference in the horse power for the D-series. I would suggest getting one with the manual, i believe the HX has the CVT tranny correct?

Im not planning on doing anything beyond adding a CAI and an MSD ignition to the engine

DO NOT get the ignition system, the stock one is fine, it'll hold up to around 200-250 HP, your going to be fine, not to mention the MSD ignition system could screw with your motor without needing the extra amprige going into the ignition system. The CAI is a good idea, look into AEM they have good products.

The one thing I do not like about the VP package is that there is no tach in the instrument cluster, but I was thinking I could install an aftermarket one on the dash anyhow. Also, there are no power windows/door locks, can I get these installed with aftermarket parts? Im just looking to save a little money up front, this is my first Civic and I want to make the right decision.

as for the tach, i would recommend getting a civic with it stock. get a manual civic and it will come with the tach. also the stock ones that come in the 7th gen civics will be just fine, they are accurate enough. as for the power options, it would be the best bet to get them stock from the factory, another option you could do is look into a used civic, just look for something newer than a 02. or you could always get a 5 year old civic, and put the rest of the money you have spent on the new car towards the old one, and have a bad ass set up.

either way is up to you, good luck with everything, and welcome to the site.

[gftgrill]

I don't think you can do msd with a 7th gen can you? they switch the ignition to a direct ignition or something. I don't remember what it is called. but they don't plugs or wires (IIRC).

also if you're looking at getting a better new civic. I say go for the si. I know it's not a D, but it's a K.

[Levi]

get at least an ex civic with a manual transmission. my ex gf had an 04 ex and that thing was really nice.

[k3rnel]

Thanks for the replies all, Im thinking the HX is my best choice. Looking at the feature matrix from Honda's website, it appears as though the only models they offer a VTEC in are the HX and EX. The only other one I would consider would be the EX, but I don't want to pay that much money(about 17-19k) I could probably get this one for around 13 flat. Too bad the VP trim package doesn't offer a tach, I can live without power door locks or windows, but a tach would be nice. The good thing is that the HX model comes standard with power door locks, no power windows, but that's ok. Im more interested in the tach and the VTEC engine than anything else. Also worth mentioning is that the engine in the HX model features "lean-burn" technology, anyone know anything about that whether it's good/bad for performance?

[k3rnel]

The difference is the VTEC only, honda uses the head to make the difference in the horse power for the D-series. I would suggest getting one with the manual, i believe the HX has the CVT tranny correct?

Just out of curiosity, am I to assume the only differences in these engines is just the head? I believe also that the CVT tranny is an auto transmission and is available as an option, I won't even consider an auto lol. They tried to make me a good deal on an '03 lastnight but the first thing I looked at was the tranny and said "NO!" lol.

[custom_junky]

ok, good...manuals are going to be the stronger tranny.

and yes the head is what is the difference in the motors, as FYI the HX motor does NOT make as much power as the EX, i'm not sure of the exact difference in power, and I believe that the pistons might be different.

as for the lean burn feature, this alows the car to get better gas mileage than the others, this could cause a problem when it comes time for upgrades, but i am not sure about that statement either. all i know is that i tried to stay away from the HX model because they come mainly with the CVT, which is not as happy as a standard auto, which is not as happy as a manual. also the manual tranny is not goingt o be a close ratio, so take offs will not be as quick as say the EX tranny, the EX tranny is a closer ratio and sportier. if you can try and talk them down on the EX price, I was able to get mine for 15-16.

[k3rnel]

Well I actually ended up with the '05 VP Model. They didn't have any HX's on the lot and wouldn't price me where I wanted to be in anything else. That's ok though, I am pretty satisfied with the one I have. I would have much rather had the Tach, etc., but I can always add this stuff myself (hopefully, I talked to AEM today and they said they didn't currently produce or have any plans to produce an intake for this model, but I believe K&M does, so there is hope lol)

So thus far, my planned upgrades are(in order of preference):

Window Tint
CAI
Tachometer
Rims/Tires
Body kit?
Carbon Fiber Hood?
Stereo?

It will be a work in progress, Im pretty excited this is the first new Honda I have ever owned, Ive had a '88, '91, and '96 Accord, but never did anything to them. Im mainly looking to make this a good looking car while fun to drive/tune in the process.

[custom_junky]

do some research and see if you can do this, but you could probably get an EX head and put it on, and have VTEC and the intake manifold for the AEM CAI. do some research first though, just a thought.

BTW, congrats on the buy :)

[Jspek_Inspired]

[QUOTE=k3rnel] (hopefully, I talked to AEM today and they said they didn't currently produce or have any plans to produce an intake for this model, but I believe K&M does, so there is hope lol)

the 04-05 vp model is the same as the 01-03 dx model, so just buy a aem intake for the the 01-03 dx and it will fit with no modification.

[k3rnel]

the 04-05 vp model is the same as the 01-03 dx model, so just buy a aem intake for the the 01-03 dx and it will fit with no modification.

That is exactly what I was wondering, I was going to just splurge and buy one to see if it would fit, but thanks for clearing me up on that.

[Import Al]

Congrats on the the new Civic. :TU: Swapping in the A2 vtec head/EX tranny plus the other options you want aren't too hard. Look on the web for all the EX opts you want or buy em brand new @ :honda: For intake, the best intake for D17's are K&N FIPK II or 2nd best Injen Race Division cai (I had it). For your hood, a CF 1 is nice, but your stocker is pretty light. The OEM body kit is tight I think.. If you want more gusto out of your EM, I have lots of suggestions (header,exhaust,hi flo cat/test pipe,TB, Y8 mani,FPR & return fuel system, etc.) Oh, this site is great for you new Civic guys-->http://www.7thgencivic.com/

[k3rnel]

Well I ended up with the "VP" model, they couldn't price me where I wanted to be in the HX model, but I am pretty happy with what I got. I would have been happier with a VTEC, but I was reading somewhere that I could do a K20 swap in this car with no modifications. I may do that once the warranty runs out, I really like this body style. I can add on power door locks/windows and a tach myself, those are the biggest features that I am missing.

[Import Al]

K3rnel, if your considering a K swap then you have a high power goal correct? The K20A2 is awesome, but to get the same power out of a turbo D17 reliably will cost thousands less. I admit that the K20 has a superior tranny, IM, fuel system I could go on BUT is $5K+ worth 178 whp when you'd have 250+ for the same price? Plus, a used D17A2 costs less than $400 bux. ;)

[k3rnel]

I'm not really looking for "raw" power per se, I just wanted something a little more powerful than what I have now while staying NA. I'm not really interested in forced induction, the HP benefits are awesome, but I would still have to use this car as my daily driver as well as taking on trips, etc so forced induction is not really an option for me. From what I have researched, simple bolt-ons to this engine(I have a D17A1) would net me anywhere from 10-20 HP. Besides, I may just get bored with the car and trade it in a few years anyhow lol. I'm certainly still learning as I go forward, I'm a confident mechanic, just not an experienced one lol. This is the first Honda I have onwed that I can actually do something with.

[Import Al]

:hijacked:You're lucky the aftermarket is finally picking up for D17s, because I know from dyno sheets that our cars wont get large gains (10-20hp) from bolt ons like previous Civics. :neutral: Companies are making
internals (cams,pistons,springs,etc.) for reliable NA power. I'll go do a search to see what you might like man, but the SF and Dezod turbo kits are pushing 7+ PSI boost for a couple years on some D17's with stock internals and no problems. Plus, the turbo guys gain 3 or so MPG on the hiway. :grin:
http://www.dezodmotorsports.com/pd_dezod_motorsports.cfm

[k3rnel]

Thanks dude, I really appreciate it! It's really helpful to me to have someone's opinions with the voice of experience, hence the reason why I came here ;) I definitely don't want to do anything crazy to my engine beyond bolt-ons until my warranty was up. I think turbo is cool, I've just read that it can be a maintenance nightmare.

[Import Al]

Great vendor of my old friends for NA D17's-->http://www.truehonda.com/inventory.php?action=showproducts&id=26
Our friend Wil, vendor here. http://exospeed.com/
I love 7th gens...:mrgreen:

[k3rnel]

Cool deal, btw that Dezod kit is sick. I may have to reconsider turbo after looking at that lol.

[Jspek_Inspired]

the best intake for D17's are K&N FIPK II or 2nd best Injen Race Division cai

Iceman intake would be the best for our cars then comes k&n, but all intakes are gonna yield similar gains so you might as well get one that looks good or something.

[Jspek_Inspired]

as for a NA build up, all you can do is I/H/E Pullies, VAFC or SAFC, clutch, lighter flywheel, and crower is releasing internals for our cars here in a couple months.

[Import Al]

Well, True Honda just finished their D17 long block a month or so ago for you NA purists. Look at all the goodies! \/\/\/

<table align="center" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr><td valign="top" width="150"><center>
$2700
Special price: $2650

Add a review (http://www.truehonda.com/inventory.php?action=addcommentform&id=71) </center></td><td width="5">
</td> <td valign="top"> D17 Longblock or Full Swap

D17 Longblock Or Full Swap

What all you new gen civic owners have been waiting for. The options for your D17. It's been here at Dh-Racing the entire time. We offer anything from valvetrain upgrades, to welded differentials for your motors. This is the completely built longblock. It comes with high compression 10.8:1 pistons, stock rods (Optional upgraded rods for $450), full race ported head, polished high flow valves, and polished combustion chambers.

CORE MOTOR IS REQUIRED, BUT INQUIRE WITHIN ABOUT US PROVIDING THE MOTOR FOR YOU (MAY CAUSE A DELAY IN SHIPMENT).

Options for this motor consist of, Racing Valve Springs ($200), Titanium Retainers ($175), Dh-Racing Camshaft ($350), Dh-Racing Crank Pulley ($150), Lightened Flywheel (Core Required)($100), 6 Puck Clutch ($130), Built Pressure Plate ($225). Tell one and tell and Dh-Racing is your one stop D17 shop.

Price is just for the longblock, all bolt-ons are listed as priced above.</td></tr></tbody> </table>
Low compression forced induction pistons are offered by Arias thru our man Wil @ Exospeed.
Please direct any questions through email(exospeedam@yahoo.com (http://email%28exospeedam@yahoo.com%29)) (http://email%28exospeedam@yahoo.com%29), phone, AOL IM(exospeedAMcrx) or Honda-Tech IM(exospeedAMcrx).
Contact Phone Number
1-818-355-6156


Also for a little more $$ JE's SRP pistons. Email them at top of page for info http://www.racetep.com/hondasrp.html

[Jspek_Inspired]

^^ lol!! I hope you don't plan to trust DH-Racing? You obviously dont know the story behind them. There products are not as good as said. Specially not for our cars. Theres no r&d in there products for our cars. He just does what he thinks will help and then call it a day. And in the end you lose power or gain minimal power.

Crower is coming out with internals for our cars in a few months and they are doing extensive r&d so save your money for that.

[Import Al]

Jspeck_Inspired yea I heard DH-R had so-so customer service and trouble backing up their crank pulley..True Honda's a different company and is well regarded by the majority of members on 7thgencivic.
Just email Eddie I believe, they do R&D (kezay gave his motor) & will be using only quality parts (Crower when complete, arias, je, srp, or skunk2, RS), that ad isn't the new package yet.
The bottom vendor in my links Exospeed Racing, a great vendor for D-Series.org and many others like Team-Integra, K-Series.com and so on.

[Jspek_Inspired]

^^ I know truehonda is a good company, I buy parts from them, what im saying is I wouldnt trust dh-r even if my life depended on it. Not only do they have a bad rep at 7thgen but the also have a very bad rep on honda tech. Im from 7thgen so I know about keezay. You make it sound like truehonda is doing the r&d for his motor, but in fact crower is doing everything, that and also they should be releasing parts for us soon.

[rotory20]

^^^hey you aint that far from me there bro..
What do you need?

[Import Al]

K3rnel & Jspek, I just was informed from Wil @ Exospeed Racing that they can fully build D17's (sleeve block, pistons from Arias/custom rods, valve srpings & retainers. All block packages incude; Bore, hone, hot tank, step deck, micropolish crank, bearings and thrust washers, bottom end gasket kit, oil pump and main seals.

They also P&P heads, the only major thing Exospeed hasn't done on a D17 is cams, but like Jspek_inspired said Crower should finish those in a few months I hope.

Keep faith in the D17 guys, 12's are just a few grand away!! :TU:

http://exospeed.com/

[k3rnel]

K3rnel & Jspek, I just was informed from Wil @ Exospeed Racing that they can fully build D17's (sleeve block, pistons from Arias/custom rods, valve srpings & retainers. All block packages incude; Bore, hone, hot tank, step deck, micropolish crank, bearings and thrust washers, bottom end gasket kit, oil pump and main seals.

They also P&P heads, the only major thing Exospeed hasn't done on a D17 is cams, but like Jspek_inspired said Crower should finish those in a few months I hope.

Keep faith in the D17 guys, 12's are just a few grand away!! :TU:

http://exospeed.com/

Good info. I keep debating whether to turbo, tune, and build my existing D17 or spend the cash on a K20. I found a JDM K20A2 that is rated at 220HP stock. Another thing, I have a D17A1 engine that is non-VTEC, is it easy to upgrade this to a VTEC?

[Jspek_Inspired]

K3rnel & Jspek, I just was informed from Wil @ Exospeed Racing that they can fully build D17's (sleeve block, pistons from Arias/custom rods, valve srpings & retainers. All block packages incude; Bore, hone, hot tank, step deck, micropolish crank, bearings and thrust washers, bottom end gasket kit, oil pump and main seals.

They also P&P heads, the only major thing Exospeed hasn't done on a D17 is cams, but like Jspek_inspired said Crower should finish those in a few months I hope.

Keep faith in the D17 guys, 12's are just a few grand away!! :TU:

http://exospeed.com/

yea i heard about that too, but i probably wont do much to my vic anymore. Waiting on the new is300 to come out then I will buy that.